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Tokyo women's 4x4 [split]

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  • So, with the time table the way it is with the overlap between the 400m and 4x400m, what do you think the line-up for qualifying will be?

    Tue pm - w800m F
    Wed am - w400mh Final , Wed pm - w400m SF
    Thurs pm - 4x400m Hts
    Fri pm w400m F
    Sat pm - w4x400m F

    If we assume all 3 US women make the 400m final, none of them will run in the 4x4 hts. If we also assume at least McLaughlin & Muhammad make the 400mh final, and medal, will they both want to even run the 4x4 hts the next day? I'd say no, and they would want to at least rest McLaughlin for the 4x4 final.

    Could we see the heats with both Muhammad and Mu?

    Note, the NED team have made a bit of a booby with selection. Marit Dopheide, who ran in their Euro 4x4 indoor gold winning team, didn't compete until the outdoor nationals due to injury. In an extremely close final, where places 2 - 6 were separated by 19/100ths, she finished 6th. Because Bol & Klaver didn't run that event, she missed making the 4x400m team and they didn't give her the opportunity to show her fitness after so close to final selections. Maureen Ellsworth, who ran brilliantly in her heat, was DQed for a lane violation, and also missed the team.

    Well, 2 weeks later Dopheide runs 52.98 to be the 4th fastest Dutch woman this season, with Ellsworth running 53.17. But instead, the Dutch will choose their 4th leg runner from either Laura De Witte (53.38) Hannecke Ossterwegel (53.44) Ann Van de Wiel (53.46) or Andrea Bouma (53.52). They are losing nearly half a second by not including Dopheide, who commits during a race, something they need in the 4x4. Including Dopheide wont help them medal, but it will give them a better chance of breaking their NC, and by a bigger margin. As it stands, the following is not unreasonable:
    Leg 1 Klaver 51.1
    Leg 2 Lisanne De Witte 51.6
    Leg 3 Whoever 53.0
    Leg 4 Bol 49.5


    Comment


    • Originally posted by Wiederganger View Post
      Could we see the heats with both Muhammad and Mu?
      The US likely wont use any of the same runners between the heats and finals as to maximize their medal haul. So I wouldn't expect Mu or McLaughlin.

      We could see Muhammad, Ellis, Whitney, Irby.

      I still do see a dilemma with the schedule since, as noted, none of the 400m women will run the 4x4 heats if they make the open final. But then one of the "top 5" (Jonathas, Felix, Hayes, Mu, McLaughlin) will not run the final.
      Last edited by ATK; 07-21-2021, 01:33 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by ATK View Post
        one of the "top 5" (Jonathas, Felix, Hayes, Mu, McLaughlin) will not run the final.
        One of those ladies will deselect herself with a minor injury from racing.

        Comment


        • The odd person out would be the lowest finisher in the 400 final.

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          • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
            The odd person out would be the lowest finisher in the 400 final.
            Unless it's Felix

            Comment


            • Originally posted by booond View Post

              Unless it's Felix
              Jonathas didn't acquit herself well in the Doha relay final but I'll bet she'll flip out if she wins silver and gets left off the relay.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by ATK View Post
                The US likely wont use any of the same runners between the heats and finals as to maximize their medal haul. So I wouldn't expect Mu or McLaughlin.

                We could see Muhammad, Ellis, Whitney, Irby.

                I still do see a dilemma with the schedule since, as noted, none of the 400m women will run the 4x4 heats if they make the open final. But then one of the "top 5" (Jonathas, Felix, Hayes, Mu, McLaughlin) will not run the final.
                With the fact that the US has a number of runners they can select as A listers from outside the 400m, it leaves anyone who doesn't end up in the open 400m final available including all of the 4th through 8th placers at the OTs.

                Covid is likely to affect any event so depth could be very important here.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by NotDutra5 View Post
                  Covid is likely to affect any event so depth could be very important here.
                  I made the comment to my wife a few days ago that I would love to sneak up on the president of NBC just as he's waking up in the morning, still groggy, and whisper to him "Simone Biles positive for Covid." You could easily substitute "Felix" there.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by cigar95 View Post
                    I made the comment to my wife a few days ago that I would love to sneak up on the president of NBC just as he's waking up in the morning, still groggy, and whisper to him "Simone Biles positive for Covid." You could easily substitute "Felix" there.
                    In another thread I mentioned that I don't know what NBC would do without Biles (Felix is a minor leaguer comparatively). 8 days of filler particularly considering it would be unlikely she'd be the only member of the squad to have it....and two already have or had it.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
                      Jonathas didn't acquit herself well in the Doha relay final but I'll bet she'll flip out if she wins silver and gets left off the relay.
                      She ran 50.1 on the anchor and the USA won by three seconds. You're a tough judge!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by gm View Post

                        She ran 50.1 on the anchor and the USA won by three seconds. You're a tough judge!
                        When it's your last race of the meet, shouldn't there be an expectation that you run hard no matter what leg you're on?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
                          When it's your last race of the meet, shouldn't there be an expectation that you run hard no matter what leg you're on?
                          and risk injury for no good purpose?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
                            When it's your last race of the meet, shouldn't there be an expectation that you run hard no matter what leg you're on?
                            There are no bonuses for running a second faster and winning by 30m instead of 20m.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by gh View Post

                              and risk injury for no good purpose?
                              . . . or risk blowing up by going out too hard when a modest pace is still good enough to win comfortably?

                              Comment


                              • So are people saying Jonathas "took it easy" the Doha anchor and did just enough to win? She looked like she was giving it her all in that relay (as she did in the open) but either just didnt have enough, or just "paced" it wrong since no one was around.

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