Tokyo women's 4x4 [split]

[guru]

We had this discussion back in 2019, and Orin Richburg put the best 4x1 and 4x4 lineups on the track in Doha. I have zero doubt he'll do the same in Tokyo.

Just as an aside, I'd be more concerned that Nike would pressure USATF to run one of it's high profile athletes(and have the leverage to do it) than NBC. But of course Felix burned that bridge.

[Tuariki]

Who in track and field right now has more name recognition to the most amount of people in and outside of track globally?

Felix, maybe SAFP, who else? Gatlin?

Right now?
Mondo, Jakob Ingebrigtsen, Mo Farah, SAFP, Eliud Kipchoge, Sifan Hassan, Joshua Cheptegei,

[bambam1729]

Right now?
Mondo, Jakob Ingebrigtsen, Mo Farah, SAFP, Eliud Kipchoge, Sifan Hassan, Joshua Cheptegei,

Maybe outside of the US or in Europe especially. Inside the USA, I would venture nobody except people on this board or who read T&F News have any idea who any of the above are. That would include most USA sportswriters or sports broadcasters, especially at ESPN.

[ATK]

You make the USATF coaches sound like political hacks.

All we could do is wait and see. I won't be shocked at anything. But but as you noted above, I HOPE guru is right.

[Tuariki]

Maybe outside of the US or in Europe especially. Inside the USA, I would venture nobody except people on this board or who read T&F News have any idea who any of the above are. That would include most USA sportswriters or sports broadcasters, especially at ESPN.

Your point re inside the USA is not disputed Bambam.

However, ATK specifically referred to recognition globally.

[ATK]

Right now?
Mondo, Jakob Ingebrigtsen, Mo Farah, SAFP, Eliud Kipchoge, Sifan Hassan, Joshua Cheptegei,

When I say globally I mean across the entire world, not in individual regions or countries around the world. But thanks, I did forget about Farah and Kipchoge, they are probably more known than Felix.

The other names you mentioned have recognition in certain locations, but are basically no names at this point.

Its only one measure of data, but Google Trends lets you compare the athletes a bit. SAFP, who I actually thought would be big, does not even scratch the surface globally relative to Farah, Kipchoge, Felix or even Gatlin, again just using this measure of data from Google.

But relating back to this topic, Felix is far an away the most well known name globally that will run for team USA and I wouldn't be surprised if powers that be want to maximize that exposure during the one time the globe is watching

[jazzcyclist]

But relating back to this topic, Felix is far an away the most well known name globally that will run for team USA and I wouldn't be surprised if powers that be want to maximize that exposure during the one time the globe is watching

How would these powers exert this influence? Do you think the CEO of NBC/Universal will call the coaches directly or will he get one of his underlings to do it?

[ATK]

How would these powers exert this influence? Do you think the CEO of NBC/Universal will call the coaches directly or will he get one of his underlings to do it?

I put nothing past large companies that are ultimately focused on gaining eyes and money. Again, I HOPE that the right team is selected as they did in Doha but would not be surprised otherwise. Even better, I would love to see Felix run 49.xx, get top 3, and end any speculation of her place on the relay.

[_Jay]

And who'$ going to tell NBC it'$ not Felix?

Felix typically doesn’t run anchor though. Even in her prime....

[jazzcyclist]

I put nothing past large companies that are ultimately focused on gaining eyes and money. Again, I HOPE that the right team is selected as they did in Doha but would not be surprised otherwise. Even better, I would love to see Felix run 49.xx, get top 3, and end any speculation of her place on the relay.

That's a non answer. Have you imagined how these "powers" would operate to put Felix in the 4x400 final if Felix finishes 8th at the Trials?

[_Jay]

If the USATF coaches would show that sort of favoritism after the 2015 Sanya Richards debacle we don't deserve a medal.

I get the correlation. But I can almost guarantee you Felix would give a sub 50 split on any leg except 1st, if she makes the team. Even if she has past accomplishments, potential ratings, etc. working in her favor more than the others....she absolutely won’t be a weak link on the relay. This isn’t Carl Lewis, politicking to make the 4x1 in ‘96.....

[ATK]

That's a non answer. Have you imagined how these "powers" would operate to put Felix in the 4x400 final if Felix finishes 8th at the Trials?

7th & 8th in the 400m at trials puts you on the mixed 4x4 pool. Anyone in Doha can run any relay once they are there. So Felix can now run the women's 4x4.

The one example of Muhammad and McLaughlin in 2019, 2 women who ran times in the hurdles that would have got them 7th & 8th at USAs in the flat 400 that year, has not completely dispelled the extreme example of SRR not even making the US final in 2015.

[_Jay]

If Felix finishes 6th in the Trials 400 with a 50.3, and there's three or four women ahead of her under 50, plus McLaughlin, plus Mu, plus Little? No, she wont be anywhere near that 4x4 final. Nor should she be.


Now let's talk about that 4x1

In that scenario, it likely isn’t done at the trials. They’ll likely need to show fitness in Tokyo as well to keep Felix off.

How many times have we seen a 400m runner make the team, PR at trials....then get to the championship and run 51 seconds to not even make the semifinals, or final??

If that happens, even if they were faster at trials...they likely insert Felix to replace that person, even if it’s as an alternate in the prelims. Felix splits 49 in the heats...and there you have it.

[jazzcyclist]

7th & 8th in the 400m at trials puts you on the mixed 4x4 pool. Anyone in Doha can run any relay once they are there. So Felix can now run the women's 4x4.

I agree with this. Any 7th or 8th placer would get mixed relay duty, not just Felix, but how does she get into the 4x400 final?

The one example of Muhammad and McLaughlin in 2019, 2 women who ran times in the hurdles that would have got them 7th & 8th at USAs in the flat 400 that year, has not completely dispelled the extreme example of SRR not even making the US final in 2015.

Why to you say that Muhammad and McLaughlin would have finished 7th and 8th in the open 400?

[Atticus]

We had this discussion back in 2019, and Orin Richburg put the best 4x1 and 4x4 lineups on the track in Doha. I have zero doubt he'll do the same in Tokyo.

And that's why this whole discussion is moot. After the smoke of individual events clears in Tokyo, he'll make the call of who looks most likely to run fast THAT DAY.