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  • #31
    Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

    An American's view from Europe:

    White says she didn't claim it because she doesn't take it regularly. Clip from her news conference on CNN. Unfortunately, she's already been condemned by the European press, who call it the biggest scandal since Ben Johnson. German TV has shown Kelli's 100 finish interspliced with Johnson's Seoul finish! Of course, the European press compared the recent Carl Lewis "scandal" with the East German doping system.

    Part of the problem is a general US holier-than-thou attitude in the world, which makes the rest of the world much less tolerant of US foibles. I think the IAAF has almost no choice but to strip her of her medals, not only because she screwed up the reporting, but also because any exoneration will be seen as a corrupt bowing to US political pressure. And European fans will never again see her as clean, no matter what happens.

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    • #32
      Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

      My bet is that the IAAF will strip her of her two medals, but then just give her a warning instead of a suspension, allowing her to compete in Berlin on Friday.

      They will also put the stuff on the banned list immediately and make it clear that further positives for this stuff by any athlete will be dealt with more harshly.

      If this is what IAAF does, USATF will just follow their lead.
      But if IAAF tries to give White a two-year suspension, USATF will appeal it as being far too harsh given the murkiness of this specific case.

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      • #33
        Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

        Has any study shown that ANY stimulant, including amphetamine, caffeine, etc. has a positive effect on performance in speed and power events? I could see an effect in long endurance (i.e. multi-day) events, but I'm frankly sceptical when it comes to shorter track events. An athlete jacked on uppers is not likely to be in the optimal performance "zone", imho. A championship situation usually presents a challenge for athletes to *dampen* the effects of overstimulation, not to stimulate even further.

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        • #34
          Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

          I also am a doctor, albeit most likely not as experienced as the others. From what I have read about modafinil, I can understand why they are taking their time about deciding how strong a "stimulant" it is. The mechanism of action is unknown. It does have some properties which resemble those of amphetamines but does not act on the same receptors. It can increase the metabolism of some other drugs (those that depend on the Cytochrome P450 system in the liver). It is a Schedule IV controlled substance whereas amphetamines are Schedule III. Schedule IV substances are generally "weaker" drugs than Schedule III and less likely to cause problems. I was looking through the Provigil website and didn't see anything about athletes shouldn't take it as one BBC journalist claims to have seen. She should have declared it. It is either an attempt to cheat or sheer stupidity. Now athletes tend not to be the brightest people when it comes to details like this, but she did have a positive drug test for triamcinalone (a cortisol like drug which is not banned by the IAAF, but is banned in France) last year so she really should have been more careful. I think she will most likely get a warning but will lose her medals
          why don't people pronounce vowels anymore

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          • #35
            Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

            "Has any study shown that ANY stimulant, including amphetamine, caffeine, etc. has a positive effect on performance in speed and power events"

            You've obviously never been on crystal meth or you would never ask the question.

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            • #36
              The family excuse...

              ...or let's see what sticks to the wall.

              "Even if genuine multiplex families are rare, 1 to 2% of the first-degree relatives of narcolepsy patients manifest the disorder, compared with 0.02 to 0.18% in the general population."

              http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... t=Abstract

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              • #37
                Re: The family excuse...

                "You've obviously never been on crystal meth or you would never ask the question."

                This has my vote for stupidest post of the year.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                  >I
                  >was looking through the Provigil website and
                  >didn't see anything about athletes shouldn't take
                  >it as one BBC journalist claims to have seen.

                  People, including the doc that White CLAIMS did extensive research on the drug, really ought to get up close and personal with google.

                  "Athletes should be aware that one of the main ingredients of this pharmaceutical product would produce a positive result in anti-doping tests."


                  http://www.biogenesis.co.za/pi-modafinil.asp

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                    >The ruling on similar drugs is quite reasonable.
                    >Last winter olympics, the cross country skier
                    >that tested positive for a chemical similar to
                    >EPO, except 1 Hydrogen molicule was altered. Thus
                    >not EPO
                    by the chemical equation, but similar. I
                    >believe if the test was positive in the USA ,
                    >USATF would cover it up. No Names, no Foul.

                    yeah, usatf is part of the problem...you can't go after drugged foreigners if you yourself are dirty....masback's gotta go.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                      pure politics and the iraq situation in other words. europeans will do anything to smear the americans right now. what did they say about an admitted cheat miknevich winning the shot by 1 1/2 feet ? how about longo in the 800 ? how about luydmila narozilenko's excuse a decade ago that her husband spiked her drink with steroids ? this is all politics and getting back at bush (sorry the us) and white is the pawn. i bet this will go to court if she is dqed.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                        <<<White says she didn't claim it because she doesn't take it regularly. Clip from her news conference on CNN. Unfortunately, she's already been condemned by the European press, who call it the biggest scandal since Ben Johnson. German TV has shown Kelli's 100 finish interspliced with Johnson's Seoul finish! Of course, the European press compared the recent Carl Lewis "scandal" with the East German doping system.><>>


                        i swear the germans are the biggest hypocrites !
                        comparing johnson to white is like comparing hitler to a lowly german who was a member of the nazi party because he had no choice. the germans are the biggest cheaters in history so what are they talking about ! how come the german press bought dieter baumann's toothpaste excuse ? ridiculous assertions from the nation that started both world wars and killed millions of people.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                          >comparing johnson to white is like comparing
                          >hitler to a lowly german who was a member of the
                          >nazi party because he had no choice.

                          Classic. Now Ben=Hitler. Do you know how offensive that is? We seem to have moved away from White's potential guilt to the usual modus operandi which can be summarized as follows:
                          1. Deny.
                          2. If the evidence can't be avoided, make up some hair brained excuse. Bring up various and sundry disabilities and exotic ailments if at all possible.
                          3. In the meantime, lawyer up.
                          4. While all this is going on, cloud the issue by bringing up Ben and how everyone is "different" than him. Throw in some eastern block stuff for good measure(and btw, I'm all for taking every last one of their records away).

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                            >> ridiculous assertions from the nation that
                            >> started both world wars and killed millions of
                            >> people.

                            Oh my .... I can't believe that you actually said this!

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                              Dear Track Physician,
                              Some of us in 'patient' circles - the national organization - were seeing it as a possible Advocacy issue. Might Kelli W be a valid, emergent case? If so, should she or any other athlete with Narcolepsy, have the right to
                              symptom relief thru medication, for competition?
                              We view this as an open question.
                              On your more specific point, that you as a Physician know of (presumably more innocuous, non-stimulant class/banned remedies) that could have been given for this "family problem" - what are they?
                              What we know about in the organization, as to agents of choice for Narcolepsy ,would all be in some 'banned' category. "Alternative medicine" approaches, are not known. What, then, do you know about? It would be great to turn up any such information.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: You Don't Wanna Know This

                                "This has my vote for stupidest post of the year."

                                Go find a healing circle and lighten up.

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