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Benjamin vs. Warholm, when? .... not Monaco

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  • proofs in the pudd'in
    replied
    Originally posted by Rack View Post
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.163 5.708 9.216 12.820 16.475 *20.241 24.166 *28.271 *32.521 *36.926 41.600 46.70
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.708 3.508 3.604 3.655 *3.766 *3.925 *4.105 *4.250 *4.405 *4.675 5.100 46.70
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.163 5.72 9.24 12.82 16.50 *20.24 *24.16 *28.26 32.52 36.92 41.60 46.70
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.72 3.52 3.58 3.68 *3.74 3.92 4.10 *4.26 4.40 4.68 5.10 46.70
    Times marked with a * have been updated.
    Made some boo-boos on the slomo at H8 and H9, don't know how that happened, fixed. Looked at some spots again, adjusted 1 frame.
    Have a hypothesis, from the slomo data, that the far-side camera in the TV feed is lagged two 25Hz frames or 0.08seconds, this would affect times at H5 H6 and H7, adjusted.
    KW went out even faster than the previous data said, if you want to entertain that thought.
    And both lines of times agree, mostly. Hooray!
    Very nice! I got 157 tot.steps (20 to first hurdle, then all 13 to 9, then15 from 9-10, then 18 to finish and then counted the landing leg after each hurdle tot.10). For funsies!

    Question: Is H5 set right at 200m? And how many tot. did Mo take?

    I posted this on your other post but it seems to be stuck in "unapproved" mode.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rack
    replied
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.163 5.708 9.216 12.820 16.475 *20.241 24.166 *28.271 *32.521 *36.926 41.600 46.70
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.708 3.508 3.604 3.655 *3.766 *3.925 *4.105 *4.250 *4.405 *4.675 5.100 46.70
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.163 5.72 9.24 12.82 16.50 *20.24 *24.16 *28.26 32.52 36.92 41.60 46.70
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.72 3.52 3.58 3.68 *3.74 3.92 4.10 *4.26 4.40 4.68 5.10 46.70
    Times marked with a * have been updated.
    Made some boo-boos on the slomo at H8 and H9, don't know how that happened, fixed. Looked at some spots again, adjusted 1 frame.
    Have a hypothesis, from the slomo data, that the far-side camera in the TV feed is lagged two 25Hz frames or 0.08seconds, this would affect times at H5 H6 and H7, adjusted.
    KW went out even faster than the previous data said, if you want to entertain that thought.
    And both lines of times agree, mostly. Hooray!
    Last edited by Rack; 07-04-2021, 01:44 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • gh
    replied
    Originally posted by 26mi235 View Post
    ... Also, the US blocks were creating problems ....
    no, skittish athletes were causing problems

    Leave a comment:


  • Atticus
    replied
    Originally posted by steve View Post
    surpassing Moses will be harder than breaking the record that Warholm just broke.
    Tafny for Understatement of the Year!

    Leave a comment:


  • steve
    replied
    Originally posted by gh View Post

    there are also hardcore statisticians who consider the Moses streak to have ended at the '84 TAC Championships, where he won his semi then pulled out of the final.
    They probably also ding him for other races they felt he should have entered but didn't. That said I don't think one needs to surpass his win streak or longevity just to surpass his GOAT status. There are other ways to take the event to new heights and places where others couldn't. For me that would involve involve world records and major championships against tough competition that could edge someone ahead of Moses. Karsten Warholm could be on his way, and definitely can't count out Rai Benjamin, but to me surpassing Moses will be harder than breaking the record that Warholm just broke.

    Leave a comment:


  • 26mi235
    replied
    I think that RB does not go out so fast because it causes him to have to chop is stride for the first part of the race. He can probably speed up a bit before is afterburners hit at 200m in the Trials, which gives him more than the 140 or so meters that he used to make up almost a second. Also, the US blocks were creating problems and I would guess that his RT was partially caution. And, it was his third race and where the risk of blowing up is a consideration that KW did not have to be concerned about. 2020 makes the stats on win streaks a little less relevant, since KW did not race anyone of note from the end of 2019 until this week.

    In a couple of years the event's neophyte might be a pretty strong contender, especially given how fast he is and how much he has to learn over the hurdles.

    Leave a comment:


  • gh
    replied
    Originally posted by Powell View Post
    No disrespect to Moses and his streak, but the 999 is somewhat inflated, since he had 2 seasons with no competitions and in 1986 at least he never raced his top rivals.
    there are also hardcore statisticians who consider the Moses streak to have ended at the '84 TAC Championships, where he won his semi then pulled out of the final.

    Leave a comment:


  • steve
    replied
    Originally posted by Powell View Post
    No disrespect to Moses and his streak, but the 999 is somewhat inflated, since he had 2 seasons with no competitions and in 1986 at least he never raced his top rivals.
    Injury for those seasons. He raced when he was ready and any of his main rivals could have found a lane in the races he did. I remember him answering those questions of dodging others in an SI article I think.

    Leave a comment:


  • Powell
    replied
    No disrespect to Moses and his streak, but the 999 is somewhat inflated, since he had 2 seasons with no competitions and in 1986 at least he never raced his top rivals.

    Leave a comment:


  • proofs in the pudd'in
    replied
    Originally posted by Rack View Post

    For funsies, I tried to take splits off this video. Luxurious! As always it's frame-counted, but now at 240Hz/0.004167sec granularity, round to the nearest hundredth if you like.
    I had to pick a finish frame, I picked 6:18 or 378 seconds and 5 frames.
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.163 5.708 9.216 12.820 16.475 20.238 24.166 28.266 32.704 37.125 41.600 46.70
    
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.708 3.508 3.604 3.655 3.763 3.928 4.100 4.438 4.421 4.475 5.100 46.70
    Also did Kevin Young's race, not as luxurious. It's hard to find a good, clean 25Hz copy that shows the whole race!
    Code:
     RT H1 H2 H3 H4 H5 H6 H7 H8 H9 H10 Final
    0.235 5.90 9.63 13.50 17.38 21.23 25.23 29.20 33.33 37.63 42.00 46.83
    6.05 9.65 13.33 17.05 20.81 24.73 28.85 32.97 37.25 41.65 46.78
    0.163 5.72 9.24 12.82 16.50 20.32 24.24 28.34 32.52 36.92 41.60 46.70
    
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.90 3.73 3.87 3.88 3.85 4.00 3.97 4.13 4.30 4.37 4.83 46.83
    6.05 3.60 3.68 3.72 3.76 3.92 4.12 4.12 4.28 4.40 5.13 46.78
    5.72 3.52 3.58 3.68 3.82 3.92 4.10 4.18 4.40 4.68 5.10 46.70
    Very nice! I got 157 tot.steps (20 to first hurdle, then all 13 to 9, then15 from 9-10, then 18 to finish and then counted the landing leg after each hurdle tot.10). For funsies!

    Question: Is H5 set right at 200m? And how many tot. did Mo take?
    Last edited by proofs in the pudd'in; 07-03-2021, 11:17 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • proofs in the pudd'in
    replied
    From wiki:

    After breaking his own world record the following year at the Drake Stadium with a time of 47.45 seconds, Moses lost to West Germany's Harald Schmid on August 26, 1977 in Berlin; this was his fourth defeat in the 400 m hurdles. Beginning the next week, Moses beat Schmid by 15 metres (49 ft) in Düsseldorf, and he did not lose another race for nine years, nine months and nine days.

    So the 999 is calculated from the last loss not from first win after that loss (which was only a week later anyway so not much difference).

    Leave a comment:


  • Rack
    replied
    Originally posted by proofs in the pudd'in View Post
    For funsies, I tried to take splits off this video. Luxurious! As always it's frame-counted, but now at 240Hz/0.004167sec granularity, round to the nearest hundredth if you like.
    I had to pick a finish frame, I picked 6:18 or 378 seconds and 5 frames.
    Code:
     RT    H1    H2     H3     H4     H5     H6     H7     H8     H9     H10  Final
    0.163 5.708 9.216 12.820 16.475 20.238 24.166 28.266 32.704 37.125 41.600 46.70
    
    S-H1  H1-2  H2-3  H3-4  H4-5  H5-6  H6-7  H7-8  H8-9  H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.708 3.508 3.604 3.655 3.763 3.928 4.100 4.438 4.421 4.475 5.100 46.70
    Also did Kevin Young's race, not as luxurious. It's hard to find a good, clean 25Hz copy that shows the whole race!
    Code:
     RT    H1   H2    H3    H4    H5    H6    H7    H8    H9    H10 Final
    0.235 5.90 9.63 13.50 17.38 21.23 25.23 29.20 33.33 37.63 42.00 46.83
          6.05 9.65 13.33 17.05 20.81 24.73 28.85 32.97 37.25 41.65 46.78
    0.163 5.72 9.24 12.82 16.50 20.32 24.24 28.34 32.52 36.92 41.60 46.70
    
    S-H1 H1-2 H2-3 H3-4 H4-5 H5-6 H6-7 H7-8 H8-9 H9-10 H10-F Final
    5.90 3.73 3.87 3.88 3.85 4.00 3.97 4.13 4.30 4.37 4.83 46.83
    6.05 3.60 3.68 3.72 3.76 3.92 4.12 4.12 4.28 4.40 5.13 46.78
    5.72 3.52 3.58 3.68 3.82 3.92 4.10 4.18 4.40 4.68 5.10 46.70

    Leave a comment:


  • gh
    replied
    Sorry, Edwin. Beck was ranked No. 6 in the world in '79 and you ran against him (and beat him of course) in the World Cup in Montréal.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tuariki
    replied
    Originally posted by proofs in the pudd'in View Post

    Agree, so what is EM 999 going by?
    Www.teamusa.org


    Screenshot_20210704_085134_com.google.android.googlequicksearchbox_edit_385753189679159.jpg

    Leave a comment:


  • gh
    replied
    Doha WC: Warholm was in 4, Benjamin in 7

    Leave a comment:

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