Duval county Challenge ATL 2022

[Atticus]

Not at all, it's not a pro-European/anti-America perspective, it's an anti-drugs perspective. .

I was not referring to drug-related posts at all.

[Wiederganger]

The answer is -- there is no transparency in doping control in any European country.

I'm afraid that is not correct. And if you think transparency is simply publishing partial test numbers on athletes, then I cannot help you there.

Rather than continue to change the course of this thread, if you want to continue this discussion further, feel free to DM me, I'm more than happy to debate this off line. 😗

[Wiederganger]

Not at all, it's not a pro-European/anti-America perspective, it's an anti-drugs perspective. There's plenty of doping in European countries, which I am more than happy to discuss, but this has nothing to do with the conversation I was having, which was about potential reasons why some US College athletes go backwards in form when they go pro (you know this, of course)

I'm stating a well known fact, that NCAA testing protocols are not aligned to WADA, which is an issue. But rather than just accept and acknowledge that, gm was trying to be smart. But it failed.

I'd actually turn this around on it's head, and say American posters are far too defensive about college sports testing, play down it's significance and cannot stand any criticism of it. But hey ho.

[Atticus]

Your snarky/sneaky little asides leave you wide open to digs.

WIederganger, we appreciate your pro-Euro perspective, but you do come across as anti-American, whether you mean it or not.

[gm]

Exactly. Why on earth anyone would expect there to be a European-wide database, when there is no European testing agency, is beyond me. A non-existent database based on a geographical continent also has nothing to do with the NCAA not fully aligning to WADA, but hey, some people just get a wee bit defensive and like to have a dig, rather than just accept a fact. 🤷

It was a simple question, since I had not been able to dig up any similar listings for any country in Europe. The answer is -- there is no transparency in doping control in any European country.

Your snarky/sneaky little asides leave you wide open to digs.

[Wiederganger]

Bouncing back from NCAA and WCT competition for the WCs may be the bigger issue.

This is where I would expect to see the decline. She is lucky that the Worlds are not later in the year, it would definitely be hard to sustain her level right through to a late August or September Championships, so she has that in her favour. Also in her favour is a home Championships, so no long-haul travel and getting accustomed to that new experience. This is all positive. However, the counter argument is the pros from her own country, who haven't been competing like workhorses in the NCAA's, also do not need to travel outside their home country for the Worlds, and will have the same benefits.

[Wiederganger]

I don't think there will be a Euro version because there are multiple testing agencies involved, either based in individual countries or groups of countries or third party providers.

Exactly. Why on earth anyone would expect there to be a European-wide database, when there is no European testing agency, is beyond me. A non-existent database based on a geographical continent also has nothing to do with the NCAA not fully aligning to WADA, but hey, some people just get a wee bit defensive and like to have a dig, rather than just accept a fact. 🤷

[El Toro]

Help me out... where can I find the European version of this -- https://www.usada.org/news/athlete-test-history/

I don't think there will be a Euro version because there are multiple testing agencies involved, either based in individual countries or groups of countries or third party providers. Even at the country level I think it's unlikely due to data protection laws, at least in EU countries and the UK for the moment. Non-EU countries may also have aligned laws to facilitate data movement with the EU.

The only data that seems to get published in places I've looked is aggregate data that doesn't identify individuals and positive tests where athletes and their offence details are published. Even the offence publication varies in detail depending on the country according to this somewhat dated but excitingly titled 2017 report:

An evaluation of the anti-doping laws and practices in the EU Member States in light of the General Data Protection Regulation

Go to Section 5.10 Analysis and Publication of Data for some background (or read the whole thing if you want to test your sanity!).

https://op.europa.eu/en/publication-...a1/language-en

[ATK]

NCAA Regionals....her next adventure...are prelims and shouldn't be all that taxing for her. The NCAA meet itself will require 2 races in the 100m, 200m, and 4 x 100m and possibly the 4 x 400m although it's possible they could sit her until the final for the longer relay assuming she runs it.

The WCTs themselves she may be fine particularly if she sticks to one event. Bouncing back from NCAA and WCT competition for the WCs may be the bigger issue.

Though I generally agree, I think you may be underestimating the transition from NCAAs to USAs. I mentioned it earlier (or in a different thread), there is no clear trend you can point to determine how "NCAA athlete X" will do at USAs and WC/OG, but there is something to be said about mentally transitioning from competing against your peers to competing in a championship setting against athletes who have been there done that.

(I note championship setting because pro athletes timelines are way different, so the one-off meets they run against NCAA athletes arent as relevant. ex LSU Joe May Invite)

[NotDutra5]

Considering she's at 37 already in May, and she has the whole of June to get through yet, including NCAA meets & the US Trials, she will be around De Grasse's number or more by the time/IF she get's the the Worlds.

Re 200m candidates, Brown has looked ominous and could be a threat behind Thomas, who must be the favourite. It might be a blanket finish though.

NCAA Regionals....her next adventure...are prelims and shouldn't be all that taxing for her. The NCAA meet itself will require 2 races in the 100m, 200m, and 4 x 100m and possibly the 4 x 400m although it's possible they could sit her until the final for the longer relay assuming she runs it.

The WCTs themselves she may be fine particularly if she sticks to one event. Bouncing back from NCAA and WCT competition for the WCs may be the bigger issue.

[gm]

the NCAA is not fully aligned to WADA. All of these are elements of differing proportions that have some impact.

Help me out... where can I find the European version of this -- https://www.usada.org/news/athlete-test-history/

[Wiederganger]

It's curious how much of a workload collegians handle, but when they become pros, they don't compete as much and then they trail off in their performances.

That's because by the time they turn pro, half of them have been burnt out by over competing! On top of that, international meets add another element (some athletes just simply don't travel well, and it can take a while to get used to the whole experience) and then there is the fact that the NCAA is not fully aligned to WADA. All of these are elements of differing proportions that have some impact.

[Wiederganger]

Andre De Grasse - Before Beijing 2015 double Bronze - 53 races
Trayvon Bromell - Before Beijing 2015 Bronze - 42 races
Christian Coleman - Before London 2017 double Silver - 49 races
Bryce Hoppell - Before Doha 4th place - 38 races

Considering she's at 37 already in May, and she has the whole of June to get through yet, including NCAA meets & the US Trials, she will be around De Grasse's number or more by the time/IF she get's the the Worlds.

Re 200m candidates, Brown has looked ominous and could be a threat behind Thomas, who must be the favourite. It might be a blanket finish though.

[Track78]

SCR looked quite good to me in that 11.27 run. Atrocious start but she went by the others fairly easily, though the celebration at the end was kind of odd. One thing is re-emphasizes for me is that pointing to the clock, raising your arms up before the finish line doesn't really hinder you as much as some people like to think! Maybe a couple hundredths!

My statement wasn't comparing the race to any other. It was simply an observation that SCR looked real good considering the circumstances. Right now everyone is at different stages of their training, the only time to compare is when they line up at Worlds.

[beebee]

I'll take an 11.07 debut over an 11.27.

You know at this point those numbers are meaningless.