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2022 Men's AOY - Take two: no horsing around this time!

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  • 2022 Men's AOY - Take two: no horsing around this time!

    Going way out on a limb here:

    Mondo
    Dos Santos
    Lyles



  • #2
    Originally posted by bad hammy View Post
    Going way out on a limb here:

    Mondo
    Dos Santos
    Lyles

    Who's 4th? Just in case medals have to be redistributed.....

    Comment


    • #3
      dos Santos & Lyles could go either way. Both became the 3rd fastest in their event while winning WC gold, dos Santos with the 3rd fastest ever and Lyles with the 4th. Both backed it up with another top 10 all time performance, dS with the # 7 and Lyles with # 9. Both won the DL final. Both had excellent competition.

      Comment


      • #4
        I think it really does just come down to how much Duplantis’ loss to Obiena counts against him enough to diminish the fact that he’s the only one of him, Lyles, and Dos Santos to set a WR. All 3 of them won all titles available to them in their main events and made a significant impact on the all time lists. Personally I’m inclined to give it to Mondo because the margin of error increases to much when you compete that much more, but his loss puts him out of the running I’m inclined to favor Lyles because it was already such a standout year in the 200 so for him to have still dominated in the manner that he has puts him ahead of Dos Santos who’s main rivals were either injured (Warholm) or skipped out on most international competition other than worlds (Benjamin).

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        • #5
          Originally posted by CD203 View Post
          I think it really does just come down to how much Duplantis’ loss to Obiena counts against him enough to diminish the fact that he’s the only one of him, Lyles, and Dos Santos to set a WR. All 3 of them won all titles available to them in their main events and made a significant impact on the all time lists. Personally I’m inclined to give it to Mondo because the margin of error increases to much when you compete that much more, but his loss puts him out of the running I’m inclined to favor Lyles because it was already such a standout year in the 200 so for him to have still dominated in the manner that he has puts him ahead of Dos Santos who’s main rivals were either injured (Warholm) or skipped out on most international competition other than worlds (Benjamin).
          Regarding Dos Santos and Lyles: I'm not 100% sure about this, but I think the only time a non-world record holder has been named AOY was in years when no world records were set (at least in this century). I may be wrong but it's hard to trump two world records.... also, being "undefeated" in primary event is a very minor criteria when compared to records, all-time peformances (as you note), World Championships, etc. Mondo also made a much greater impact on the all-time performance list than the other two (Added WR's 6.21, 6.20. then 6.16, then 4 6.10's. two enroute to a higher height....that's bonkers) ....as stated above Lyes added 4th best all-time, then replaced his Albums with a better tiime - Dos Santos added 3rd best all-time, then #7, he already had the 4th/ now 5th on the list)

          I do agree with you about Lyles getting the edge over Dos Sants as he faced all competition pretty head on, though I also have trouble "penalizing" someone for other people's injuries. What I think gives Lyles the edge is just the overall level of the 200 this season compared to the overall level of the 400IH

          My list continues:

          Mondo
          Lyles
          Dos Santos

          4th for medal redistribution: Crouser unless Kipchoge does something crazy, I don't know what to do then.

          Should Mondo get any "consideration" for not being named AOY by T&FN in 2020 due to the covid season not having an AOY ? He's been on an amazing 3+ year run and has yet to be recognized as AOY.... 7 WR's (counting indoor and out) College Record, U20 record, HS record, etc He's been something like 54-3 for the last 3 years



          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by DET59 View Post

            My list continues:

            Mondo
            Lyles
            Dos Santos

            4th for medal redistribution: Crouser unless Kipchoge does something crazy, I don't know what to do then.

            Should Mondo get any "consideration" for not being named AOY by T&FN in 2020 due to the covid season not having an AOY ? He's been on an amazing 3+ year run and has yet to be recognized as AOY.... 7 WR's (counting indoor and out) College Record, U20 record, HS record, etc He's been something like 54-3 for the last 3 years



            Michael Norman, anyone? Undefeated at 400m with two sub-44 clockings and the big title.

            Comment


            • #7
              Might put El Bakkali as a contender for 4th though give his dominant season.

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              • #8
                I think PVers should be cut some slack for an isolated off-event. The variables and chances of stuff happening are greater than in (most?) other events.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by gm View Post

                  Michael Norman, anyone? Undefeated at 400m with two sub-44 clockings and the big title.
                  Great season but didnt PR, didn't add to all time top 10, kinda shut down after worlds; I'd put him 4th or 5th?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DET59 View Post

                    Great season but didnt PR, didn't add to all time top 10, kinda shut down after worlds; I'd put him 4th or 5th?
                    I'd like nothing more than to rank Norman highly, but as you note, he's short on marks at the highest level.
                    He's also short on competitions in general - his 400 season is one race longer than McLaughlin's. (True, he also ran the 200 three times, but as he didn't win any of them, that doesn't help him in the evaluation either.)
                    My guess is MN finishes sixth.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by cigar95 View Post

                      I'd like nothing more than to rank Norman highly, but as you note, he's short on marks at the highest level.
                      He's also short on competitions in general - his 400 season is one race longer than McLaughlin's. (True, he also ran the 200 three times, but as he didn't win any of them, that doesn't help him in the evaluation either.)
                      My guess is MN finishes sixth.
                      I agree with you & DET59, and would probably put El B at 5 and MN at 6. El B competed in the DL and won the DL title, which in my mind puts him slightly above MN. JI would come next for me. Crouser, even with his 2 losses to JK, would be somewhere between 7 and 8, along with Ceh. Where does Kerley fit in?

                      If Kipchoge runs sub 2:03, he is in the mix between 6 & 10, especially if he goes sub 2:02. But one of these days age will catch up with him. I just hope it's not until after 2024.

                      Edit: I don't know what I was thinking. I'm off by one after Mondo, Lyles, & dos Santos. I must have been thinking about a phantom # 4!
                      Last edited by bobguild76; 09-12-2022, 07:07 PM.

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                      • #12
                        El Bakkali ran in five meets in the 3000SC, and his best time is No. 24 on the all-time performance list.
                        Norman's 43.56 is No. 13 on the A-T 400 performance list.

                        Both are very worthy candidates for 4 & 5 in the AOY vote.

                        Ceh and Ingebrigtsen are locks for 6 & 7 to me, but as much as I love Crouser he probably doesn't have quite enough to be top 8 (tough year).

                        Toss-up between dos Santos and Lyles for No. 1 for me.

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                        • #13
                          i probably put both Crouser and Kovacs ahead of both El Bakkali and Norman

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                          • #14
                            1-Mondo (the flying Swedish, not the synthetic ground)
                            2-Lyles (not the brother)
                            3- Dos Santos and Mister Kovacs

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by 79 View Post
                              1-Mondo (the flying Swedish, not the synthetic ground)
                              2-Lyles (not the brother)
                              3- Dos Santos and Mister Kovacs
                              2 weeks ago, I had

                              Originally posted by Atticus
                              1. Mondo
                              2. Dos Santos
                              3. Lyles
                              4. El B
                              5. Norman
                              Upon further reflection, I'd like to change that . . . not at all.
                              Mondo's loss doesn't outweigh his prodigious achievements​ (incl. POY, WR, WC Gold, DL champ).

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