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  • Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

    Seeing the 17:44 for Gill, figure that that has a value of about a 5:00 mile (Purdy Tables). Okay, so not all milers run competitively at 5k. But virtually all run or have run seriously at 800/880. Anybody know what the biggest differential is for a sub-4 miler? In other words, who has the slowest PR at 800 or 880 and has still broken 4-minutes? (I suppose the answer could be an Ethiopian who records the sub-4 at the end of a 5k, but....)

  • #2
    Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

    Tom, seriously, I can run 17:44 on 4 months of training (from doing nothing) and I suck. I can also do the 5:00 for Mile on the Purdy tables. This guy will never get under 2:00 in the 800 by summer. If he was really doing 100 mile weeks, coach Brown needs to start hanging out with Ronald Reagan, cause he's lost it too.

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    • #3
      Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

      Also, an "elite miler" would train faster that than 17:44 5km pace on the slow 10 miler. The guy's a joke.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

        >Seeing the 17:44 for Gill, figure that that has a
        >value of about a 5:00 mile (Purdy Tables). Okay,
        >so not all milers run competitively at 5k.

        He should be doing a large part of his training at that pace-forget running competitively at it.

        >Dick has mentioned this guy several times to me, >and believes that he can run a good mile. >Perhaps even qualify for the Olympic Trials. I'm >skeptical, but I have great respect for Dick's >coaching abilities.

        I would imagine that you remain skeptical?

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        • #5
          Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

          Casper the friendly ghost has posted a better time this week on spooky mountain. According to well placed sources he ran a 13:47 this weekend.

          Bionic big foot did even better. Despite his alien bionics being nearly 30 years old, bionic big foot ran a 4 minute 5k. Since his electronic are getting older he can no longer maintain 60 mph.

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          • #6
            Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

            to answer tom's question, i have run sub 4 and i have been in races with a couple of guys that seem to be all out from the gun. dan browne was one. he ran 3:59 when i raced him and i think he was kicking the whole race! the other was buck jones. that was one tough guy, and still is! both are class guys, so this is not a knock on them by any means, but i doubt that they have run very fast 800m times. those are just guys that i have raced and it seemed like they were redlining the whole way! good question. i would like to know as well.

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            • #7
              Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

              Dan Browne has run 1:49.81 for 800m, so he's got some speed.

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              • #8
                Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                In the mid 1980's as high school junior I had 23.9 200m speed and 50.8 400m speed but now I am a ultra-marathon runner.

                Funny thing is I was never any good at the mile. I had good basic foot speed and very good endurance but was never able to put the two together very well.

                On the other hand I know plenty of guys who I could out run over 200m who I never could beat over 1 mile but then again I can beat them over 50 miles.

                There are very real differences between:
                1) Speed
                2) Stamina
                3) Endurance

                Some people have talent at 1 of these:
                Either Good Speed, Good Stamina or Good Endurance

                Some where blessed with two:

                i.e Good Speed and Good Stamina
                or Good Stamina and Good Endurance

                I'm one of the rare ones who are bless with two but not complimentary ones .. i.e Speed & Endurance (which does not unfortuantely equal stamina)

                Very very few (Steve Ovett, Jim Ryan)
                are blessed with serious talent at all three.

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                • #9
                  Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                  Gills statements about Alan Webb now seem very funny! This article was a riot. What a propaganda peice!

                  "I'll go on record as saying that for Alan Webb, his high school years were as good as it's going to get," says Gill.

                  In the Olympic Trials, Gill predicts that he'll run under 3:35. At the Olympics, he'll boldly move to the front, where he couldn't care less about the clock. "I'm not running for a time in Athens," says Gill. "I'm running to win."

                  A 17:44 is a long way from a 3:53 mile!!!
                  This is great!!

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                  • #10
                    Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                    >Gills statements about Alan Webb now seem very
                    >funny! This article was a riot. What a propaganda
                    >peice!

                    I just emailed them and asked them if, given the fact that he is a fraud, they will be doing a follow up piece. Will post the reply if I get one.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                      Gills statements about Alan Webb now seem very funny! This article was a riot. What a propaganda peice!

                      "I'll go on record as saying that for Alan Webb, his high school years were as good as it's going to get," says Gill.

                      In the Olympic Trials, Gill predicts that he'll run under 3:35. At the Olympics, he'll boldly move to the front, where he couldn't care less about the clock. "I'm not running for a time in Athens," says Gill. "I'm running to win."

                      A 17:44 is a long way from a 3:53 mile!!!
                      This is great!!<<

                      Is there any chance he was doing this as a "fun run" or very easy jog?

                      I mean, he was a 15 minutes 5K guy when he was a teenager, right? Any healthy, well-trained 34 year old should be able to run much faster than they did at 17...

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                      • #12
                        Re: Gill a media invention

                        Gill could be a showman deliberately running slow in the beginning so he can rise up like a phoenix and surprise everyone later. Maybe his next race he will improve to 14:00. At least Gabe's comeback is based on realistic elite performance goals. There is a 50% that Gabe will be back in 3:55 mile condition. Gill is probably a 4:20 miler who was just jogging a 5k race to get in shape.

                        Ever since reality TV has hit the mass culture public interest has centered on showmanship rather than actual athletic accomplishment. The only reason the reporter covered the Gill story was because it was a spectacle. Jon Gill is a creation of the media. It was never important that he could not run the times he was bragging about. Today an idiot on survivor can get as much fame as a professional athlete for eating worms. Freaks and publicity seekers now can become famous. If Jon Gill track career stalls he can always join survivor.


                        As for the article the paper will pretend it never existed. They will not respond to your letter.

                        If there are no dynamic US distance runners the media will find a way to create one. I am sure another Jon Gill will pop up next year.

                        This Jon Gill farce makes the whole Gabe Jennings saga looks less ridiculous. At least Gabe is a professional runners with a decent chance of making the Olympic team. I have no idea if Gill has even broken 4:15 for the mile.

                        The Jon Gill story reminds me of the New York Times fabrication scandle this past summer. It is on a much smaller scale but indicative of the same problem.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                          >In the mid 1980's as high school junior I had
                          >23.9 200m speed and 50.8 400m speed but now I am
                          >a ultra-marathon runner.

                          If you were a 23.9 200 runner, there's no way you ran 50.8 for the 400. It's not possible.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                            "If you were a 23.9 200 runner, there's no way you ran 50.8 for the 400. It's not possible."

                            Beg to differ, as I have 2 kids w/similar #'s currently. Also, I ran 25.1/52.8 in high school as a miler - his numbers are likely legit - if you follow his posts it's obvious he doesn't BS. Why so negative?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Biggest Differential: 800/880 & Mile

                              Tom - to answer your original question, Bob Kennedy comes to mind as a guy with a quick mile (3:56 I believe) but I don't recall him ever running a fast 800m. Maybe someone know his 800m best.

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