Columnist Admits That Track Is Harder Than It Looks

[tandfman]

“Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not, nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not, unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not, the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan, “press on” has solved, and always will solve, the problems of the human race.” - Calvin Cooledge

Isn't there some local variation of Godwin's Law that says the first person attempting to prove his point by quoting Calvin Coolidge loses?

Yes, especially when he misspells Coolidge.

[gh]

For those not familiar with Godwin's Law (I knew the concept; didn't know it was named after anybody):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_Law

edits an attempt to make URL complete, but it just won't take. You'll have to cut and paste.

[MJD]

Fascinating article....

Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments

Funny:

"In sum, we present this article as an exploration into why people
tend to hold overly optimistic and miscalibrated views about
themselves. We propose that those with limited knowledge in a
domain suffer a dual burden: Not only do they reach mistaken
conclusions and make regrettable errors, but their incompetence
robs them of the ability to realize it. Although we feel we have
done a competent job in making a strong case for this analysis,
studying it empirically, and drawing out relevant implications, our
thesis leaves us with one haunting worry that we cannot vanquish.
That worry is that this article may contain faulty logic, methodological
errors, or poor communication. Let us assure our readers
that to the extent this article is imperfect, it is not a sin we have
committed knowingly."

Professionals who don't know their own limitations are dangerous.

[MJD]

"edits an attempt to make URL complete, but it just won't take. You'll have to cut and paste.

Last edited by gh on 30 May 2007 08:05; edited 3 times in total"

Not exactly a real high priority item, obviously, but I think some kind of setting has been changed because the number of edits you make now shows up on your post no matter how fast you make them and I think that is just the case on the current board.

[tandfman]

If what MJD just said is true, it must be a VERY recent development. I did a post-and-edit less than an hour ago and the edit doesn't show because I made it within a minute or two of the posting.

[MJD]

If what MJD just said is true, it must be a VERY recent development. I did a post-and-edit less than an hour ago and the edit doesn't show because I made it within a minute or two of the posting.

On this board?

edit-very fast test edit

mmm...I don't know what is going on then unless the timer has been changed, I think it used to be about 5 minutes...maybe it is a minute now or maybe it is sporadic.

[guru]

If what MJD just said is true, it must be a VERY recent development. I did a post-and-edit less than an hour ago and the edit doesn't show because I made it within a minute or two of the posting.

I believe if you edit before someone else posts on that thread after you it doesn't show.

[MJD]

That must be it. That is what just happened to me. Two edits up there. NEVER MIND.

[tandfman]

I believe if you edit before someone else posts on that thread after you it doesn't show.

I never knew that, but you're right. I just checked by editing a two-day old post that was the last on that thread. Edited it without a trace.

The other thing you can do as long as yours is the last post on the thread is delete your post entirely.

[Mennisco]

This is a lively discussion. It appears that Malmo is saying hard work is more important than talent,.

Yes it is. All the talent in the world means nothing without application of hard work. Hard work, consistency and persistence can be, and often is, the equalizer.

“Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not, nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not, unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not, the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan, “press on” has solved, and always will solve, the problems of the human race.” - Calvin Cooledge

Malmo, you've hit the proverbial nail on the head with your point. The example I remember most readily is usually the one about Edison, who, after succeeding in inventing the light bulb using N number of tries, said he didn't fail [N-1] number of times, he found [N-1] ways not to invent a light bulb.

Here's a good collection of different ways of saying this:

http://tinyurl.com/2jrdt8

Now having said this, here is an example of someone who could train a billion times harder than Malmo, and never stand a ratty-assed chance in purgatory of running better than 12 seconds in a 100:

[jazzcyclist]

This is a lively discussion. It appears that Malmo is saying hard work is more important than talent,.

Yes it is. All the talent in the world means nothing without application of hard work. Hard work, consistency and persistence can be, and often is, the equalizer.

“Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not, nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not, unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not, the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan, “press on” has solved, and always will solve, the problems of the human race.” - Calvin Cooledge

"If character, perserverence and discipline mattered, then Army and Navy would play for the national championship every year." - Bobby Bowden

[skyin' brian]

This is a lively discussion. It appears that Malmo is saying hard work is more important than talent, while Tafnut and others are saying that no amount of hard work is sufficient to overcome a talent deficit. I think these arguments can be applied in many arenas, not just track and field. In my humble opinion, American Idol is without peer as an example of people fooling themselves into believing that if they just work hard enough, they can succeed [as a singer]. I've been around the recording industry enough to know how hard some people [not me] work at launching a career. One determined fellow had more drive, belief in himself, and determination than anyone, with maybe the exception of Madonna. 2-3 seconds of hearing his music made it deafeningly clear that he wasn't a rose blooming in the desert, at least in terms of musical ability. And that's being kinder than that bombastic asshole Simon what's his dumbass face.

I trained very, very hard for 4 years in track. My coach told me years later she had never seen anyone train as hard as I did. At 12, 13, and 14 years of age, I'd be running repeat 150s, 200s and 300s in driving snow and extremely bitter wind - in southwestern Ontario. By myself. On a street sidewalk, by light of street lamp. I'd be at school the next morning training from 7-8:30. I apparently had the best hurdles form many coaches had seen in the province - and it was tragically transparent that I lacked the speed to go with the form. I also swam competitively in high school. Typical workouts with a local club involved being at the pool at 5:30 am, and doing 20x400 with 15 seconds rest between each, or 5x1500 with 1 minute rest between. I busted my insufficiently talented ass - and developed some mental toughness in the process. But no way was I ever gonna be in the Olympics.

Talented people occasionally take the viewpoint that they simply worked harder than those behind them. Sometimes true, sometimes not.

Maybe you overtrained

[Mennisco]

"If character, perserverence and discipline mattered, then Army and Navy would play for the national championship every year." - Bobby Bowden

I'm feeling persercuted by people who don't try hard enough to learn how to spell. :wink:

http://tinyurl.com/2yzjl5

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/perserverance

Just my personal преферанс.

[Mennisco]

Maybe you overtrained

You bring up something possibly a little too close to the truth for my own comfort level Brian! :wink: I used to train with the Kitchener-Waterloo Track Club in early and mid seventies. The head coach was Brent McFarlane, author of "The Science of Hurdling and Speed":

http://www.amazon.com/Everything-Track- ... B00067109C

He later became the head coach for the Canadian track team in Sydney. In those days when I trained with Jan Hember and Brent, we'd often meet at a place called Blue Springs, in the dead of winter. Up a very steep snow-covered sand dune we'd go, sometimes knee-deep in snow, with some other poor monkey on our back, but we loved it! Unforgiving minutes, seemingly endless repetitions of running up the steps at Centennial Stadium in Kitchener, ...........yeah it was hard! In retrospect, I think I might have focused on speedwork more [not that I had an abundance of fast-twitch fibers] and strength conditioning a bit less.

I'm actually getting into the best shape of my life lately. Been swimming the longest distances ever - up to nearly 2 miles, followed by lots of sprints, backstroke, breaststroke and freestyle. Bench pressing a pyramid set of about 80-90 total reps, top of pyramid=4 reps at 225, do that twice then work back down. Gotta quit smoking, but I still do an 8k run, then light up. But looking great, of course that's the most important thing. Duh. :lol:

[Novitiate]

You may find an explanation that elucidates one of your "problems" in this article, Menny :

http://www.athleticquickness.com/page.asp?page_id=56