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Stacy at 15'5 again

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  • tafnut
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Geez, OV, you hustler, you. That's too rich for my blood - I ain't no Pete Rose. But now that I've shot my mouth off (well, fingers, but that's too bloody an image), I guess I have to show. How about next year's HS Annual vs. an ATFS Annual? I think the ATFS is triple the price of the HS. I'm sure I've set the odds way too low, but I really, really want SD to do it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Pego
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    I am from central Europe and we were very much aware of imperial landmarks such as 7feet HJ, 30f LJ, 70f SP and so on. In Charles Dumas obituary, central European newspapers I followed emphasized how important those marks are for the Americans.

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  • Powell
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    >Well I am European so do have some knowledge about these things! Firstly, I had
    >no clue how high 16' was until I calculated it last night, and I'm a hard core
    >field event fan.

    That sort of sums it up... plus you actually come from the country where the imperial measurements were invented, and they were commonly used until recently. To an ex-Soviet, 20 feet is as abstract as if you said to an American that Bubka vaulted 18 chi (yes, the correct response is 'what???'... chi is a Chinese unit of length).

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  • marknhj
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Well I am European so do have some knowledge about these things! Firstly, I had no clue how high 16' was until I calculated it last night, and I'm a hard core field event fan. I think Sergie was aware (or made aware) of the significance of 20' in the USA because of his business savvy. At that time there was still the possibility that the US market was one that he could exploit financially. I doubt if Soto had any clue what 8' meant.

    I'm going to Vegas this afternoon. I'll check what odds we can get on both 5m. and 16' and report back!

    Leave a comment:


  • gh
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    >Take my word for it - NOBODY in continental Europe (or any other place in the
    >world which was never under British/US reign) knows or cares about feet and
    >inches. Both Javier Sotomayor and Sergey Bubka had to be told of the imperial
    >significance of records they set (8 ft. and 20 ft., respectively) and even then
    >they laughed at the idea anyone considered it important.>>

    WRONG!
    Sergey Bubka, T&FN, April 1991, after his 20-0 (oh, sorry, 6.10) in San Sebastian: "I'm especially happy because this will get a lot of attention in America. 20-feet will mean more to Americans than Europeans. this record is a gift to the United States."

    Sergey knew (and knows) good marketing when he saw it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Powell
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Take my word for it - NOBODY in continental Europe (or any other place in the world which was never under British/US reign) knows or cares about feet and inches. Both Javier Sotomayor and Sergey Bubka had to be told of the imperial significance of records they set (8 ft. and 20 ft., respectively) and even then they laughed at the idea anyone considered it important.

    Leave a comment:


  • Powell
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    I agree 5 meters this year is not realistic. The WR only progressed by a total of 1 cm in the last 2 seasons... OK, this may be the year when the progression re-starts, but not at that sort of rate. The record just ain't that soft any more.

    Leave a comment:


  • tafnut
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Have you ever noticed that some events plateau and then suddenly quantum leap upward? I think we're at that stage right now with wPV. Look at how many women are at or near WR. One of them is due a big jump, just by law of averages, and the top 5 or so realize it may take a near 16' jump to win OG, so they are all ratcheting up their own expectations. I may be totally wrong, but I'm saying that 16' will go in June and there will be several jumps after that to get to 5m. Big order, but doable, just because of the event's dynamics this year. So one of us can say, "I told you so" at the end of the year. I do get 3-1 odds, don't I? (inferred from the tone of your poat)

    Leave a comment:


  • marknhj
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    I don't think there's any chance of 5m. for the women this year. An 18cm improvement in the next 8 months or so. Come on, get real. 16' may be possible but I wouldn't count on that even. Remember, 16' means nothing to the Russians. When the record does fall (and it will, probably several times)the next barrier the Russians will care about is 4.90 (yes, I know that's 16' and change). Sure the event is still new and has progressed rapidly, however this progression will obviously start slowing down.

    Leave a comment:


  • Per Andersen
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    I think the complaining about the short pegs have been somewhat overdone. We can all see that 2003 was a better year resultswise than 2002 when the long pegs were still in use. Did not Mesnil at least have a couple of attempts at 6m? 6m is quite likely in 2004 and then how far away are we really?
    Maybe the old pegs made more sense in the old days when the old, light wooden bars were in use. Try Wolzing on those bars. There was room for two bars side by side on those old pegs. With the modern bars, was all that room too much of an advantage?
    However, U.S. vaulting has clearly stagnated even the women have tailed off a bit. Nobody had an older team than the U.S. (men) in Paris. Youngest guy was 32 or so. But the question is why? Is the U.S. falling behind at the coaching level? Are there too many vaulting centers spread over the country with too little contact?
    I sure don't know but I am really mystified.

    Leave a comment:


  • tafnut
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    I would guess that the new peg/bar tripled the difficulty of Volzing, which is why they did it, of course. Instead of making the officials do their job, they just made an already extraordinarily difficult event even harder (and less enjoyable for the fans). But don't get me started! The IAAF's has done lots stupider stuff, but this one really was ill-conceived.

    BTW, I hereby apologize to the IAAF/IOC on their Oly SP idea. It seems most of the big shots (get it?) like the idea, so who are we to argue?

    Leave a comment:


  • KLocke
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    well, some of those men like to use there hands, haha...

    Brits won his way with this in Paris on his 2nd attempt at 5.85



    >"Regarding the pegs, It really only affected the men who tend to come down on
    >the bar


    "

    Good point - men tend to get more vertical and pike more over the
    >bar, so they are more apt to dislodge the new bar/peg.

    Leave a comment:


  • tafnut
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    "Regarding the pegs, It really only affected the men who tend to come down on the bar"

    Good point - men tend to get more vertical and pike more over the bar, so they are more apt to dislodge the new bar/peg.

    Leave a comment:


  • KLocke
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Okkert Brits & Lobinger have each jumped 6 meters. Regarding the pegs, It really only affected the men who tend to come down on the bar

    ie. Hartwig,Brits,Markov

    Lobinger does not have this tendency nor does Miles. So, a healthy Lobinger will raise the bar.



    No one has done it with short pegs (another blow to an already
    >staggering event). Who will be the next over 6m? Hartwig and Markov have done
    >it before.

    I think Markov has a chance of coming on strong this year, and he's
    >my very early pick for Athens, but I'm honestly not that enthusiastic about his
    >chances, or anyone else's. This event stumps me right now. I hope someone
    >emerges this year. Right now Markov, Lobinger, Averbukh, Miles, and several
    >others in the low 19's.

    Leave a comment:


  • KLocke
    replied
    Re: Stacy at 15'5 again

    Medal Pool:Svetlana,Yelena,Dragila,Buschbaum,Becker and Pyrek

    Championship vaulting is like shooting dice. I think about Kristiansson & Gibilisco on the men's side

    Leave a comment:

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