Weakest U.S. track and field event

[olorin]

Re:

wTJ, wHT, wJT

I believe that wSP is also deserve a mention in American "hall of shame"

[Riff80]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

I'll have to go with the wTJ.
Do they even compete outside the USA on the normal pro circuit.

[7-sided]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

My point is that if we limited the furriners, we would HAVE to start coaching up the Amis. There ARE good American TJ coaches, but if we can just raid the foreign pantries for talent, the Ami girls won't get the attention they need. We OBVIOUSLY have the native talent, but there's no will to develop it as there is on foreign shores. So the event continues to languish here.

Marlow, again, I mirror your frustration at the very limited 'success' of American women TJ, but I disagree that limiting scholarships to foreigners helps this. The point is that even the foreign-NCAA wTJ are no threat to medal at global championships. In fact, they aren't even threats to make the global finals. Also, the extent to which they were "coached" is debatable - as the foreigners were usually better performers the day they showed up on campus.

We have to remember that "world standard" is at least 14 meters! There were twenty (20) women of college age in the world last year who exceeded 14 meters. None were Americans! If we rolled the standard to 13.50 (but less than 14 meters) it would mushroom to 43 for non-Americans, globally, yet there were only 3 Americans of college age to exceed 13.50. This is a coaching issue. There is NO WAY that the levels of participation could be so high and have such poor quality among Americans. It's statistically impossible.

Note that the USA had 8 jumpers above 13.50 and only 3 were of "college-age" (born '85 or later). Below find a sample of some of the "track powers" that are outperforming the USA in the wTJ.

13.97 A -0.4 Verónica Davis VEN 22/05/1987 1 Sucre 24/11/2009
13.61 A Aide Yesenia Villareal MEX 12/01/1986 1 Guanajuato 12/07/2009
13.56 -0.4 Camélia Sahnoune ALG 05/04/1986 1 Alger 22/07/2009
13.54 0.0 Maliakhal A. Prajusha IND 20/05/1987 1 Kochi 03/05/2009
13.48 0.9 Sirada Seechaichana THA 29/01/1986 2 Vientiane 14/12/2009

The problem, and this is probably for another thread, is that the USA has no development system! At all, for any of the events. Everyone, including Logan, likes to point to these participation rates, but USATF does not have an official mechanism for developing athletes (I'm not countiing USOC...)! The NCAA does nearly all of the heavy lifting and Nike, which has a vested interest, does a great portion of the remainder...neither one of these institutions answer to USATF, and consequently, they have different goals. USATF doesn't even qualify as a symbiote in the relationship as there really is no essential partnership; I think scavenger would be a better metaphor. To be fair, and for the record I'm not a USATF or Logan basher (I actually like the guy), USATF does have very informative coaching summits but the sprints and distances get much of the attention - and in the case of the sprints...deservedly so. That said, USATF needs to fully fund a wTJ national coach and fully fund all athletes above 14.40. Mutually beneficial for the athlete, the national coach and the resulting finals and medals for the USA.

One more thing, until an American coach proves that they can coach women beyond 14 meters consistently, hire a Cuban.

[Marlow]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Lots of good points there 7-S.

I'd love to see what would happen if we allowed coaches to recruit all the foreigners they wanted, but none could score at conference or nationals. I think all the 'altruism' would go out the window immediately.

[7-sided]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Initially I thought that you were interested in what the weakest events were...and I'm sure that you are, but it seems to have revealed that you may be anti foreign-collegiate as well. That's all right, I just completely disagree. I am not exactly sure what it would accomplish, but I never hear it from NCAA basketball - though the numbers may be similar in terms of %.

Anyway, back to the thread topic...

The interesting thing about the triple jump is that the US had the head start (the rest of the world wasn't even competing in the triple jump, for the most part, when Sheila Hudson was WR holder), and, if it were not for the expense of pit equipment, the wPV may have suffered the same fate.

[Marlow]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

it seems to have revealed that you may be anti foreign-collegiate as well. That's all right, I just completely disagree. I am not exactly sure what it would accomplish, but I never hear it from NCAA basketball - though the numbers may be similar in terms of %.

I'm just frustrated. I see college coaches raid the overseas market to gain success, rather than take the US tax-money (in many, but not all) and invest it in American kids. I really don't see many other countries using their coaches, facilities, time, energy and money to develop USA kids, do you? And then WE get bad-mouthed for 'exploiting' them! Just don't seem fair, do it?
I also see US coaches saying how important the foreigners are to have in their programs to promote world understanding. BFS! They just want their conference and national points, so they can say how awesome they are as coaches. :evil:

But you're right, this is another rant altogether. . .

[Riff80]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Erica McLain jumped a windy 47-3 3/4 today at the California Relays. Best American mark since 2008.

I don't know if it's bad luck or what, but all of her best jumps seem to be wind aided.
Maybe she will compete in some meets outside the USA. She could be competitive, and being in some meets where you know the winning jump is going to most likely be a high 47 or better wouldn't hurt.

[Gebrucilassie]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Definitely the women's TJ, since we've never had a good one. Yeah, I know a couple of them won some meets with 46 foot jumps.

Never had a good one? Have you already forgotten Sheila Hudson? I know it has been a good 12 or so years since she competed but she was definitely "good"

[Riff80]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Definitely the women's TJ, since we've never had a good one. Yeah, I know a couple of them won some meets with 46 foot jumps.

Never had a good one? Have you already forgotten Sheila Hudson? I know it has been a good 12 or so years since she competed but she was definitely "good"

Not only good but very consistent, and oh so beautiful.

[lonewolf]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Has it been 12 years since Shiela jumped? By grand coincidence I happened to be the Pit Judge for two/three of her American records, Atlanta, New Orleans and someplace else, maybe Sacramento.
She was undoubtably the most precise, compact, technically correct TJer, male or female, I ever watched. She got the most out of her diminutive frame and looked oh so good doing it... nothing in the pit to mark except two perfectly aligned size five footprints..
As if talent and looks were not enough, she rivaled JJK for "niceness".
If it sounds like I am a Shelia Hudson fan, Yep.

[Pego]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

My point is that if we limited the furriners, we would HAVE to start coaching up the Amis.

Do I recall correctly that the last "furriner" female TJer that amounted to world class was Trecia Smith? It's been a while.

[lonewolf]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

My point is that if we limited the furriners, we would HAVE to start coaching up the Amis.

Do I recall correctly that the last "furriner" female TJer that amounted to world class was Trecia Smith? It's been a while.

She is the last one I remember.. popped a big jump at Sacto in 2000 (?)

[Riff80]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

Has it been 12 years since Shiela jumped? By grand coincidence I happened to be the Pit Judge for two/three of her American records, Atlanta, New Orleans and someplace else, maybe Sacramento.
She was undoubtably the most precise, compact, technically correct TJer, male or female, I ever watched. She got the most out of her diminutive frame and looked oh so good doing it... nothing in the pit to mark except two perfectly aligned size five footprints..
As if talent and looks were not enough, she rivaled JJK for "niceness".
If it sounds like I am a Shelia Hudson fan, Yep.

USA Indoor Championships 1999 Atlanta

[leoesharkey]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

the worst american event is probably the ladies shot put, why? with an olympic champion in the discus and lots of 70m hammer throwers, the girls just don't want to do the shot in any great numbers in the US, the coaching expertise is everywhere in the US, the level of male shotputters with 6 active throwers over 71 feet right now has never being higher.

[unclezadok]

Re: Weakest U.S. track and field event

I had not forgotten Sheila Hudson. I believe she ranked as high as 10th in the world in the T &FN rankings. If only the TJ had weight classes...