Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Rounds Question

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Rounds Question

    I'm a fan of the sport and have never been a runner, but I have a question regarding the effect of the rounds on an athlete's performance. We all see the runners ease up, say in the 100 meter race, with 10 or 20 meters remaining and the rationale is that the runner is conserving him or herself for the race next day. Perhaps my assumption is faulty and maybe the fear of injury is what causes them to ease up (or both) -- but don't these folks train rigorously enough that pushing ahead isn't going to adversely affect the next performance (which might not occur for another 24 hours)? Perhaps some of you with actual experience can explain the effect of the rounds ... Yes, I understand that many, many rounds can tire one out; but I would think that, in a rigorous practice session, an athlete might run the 100 meters at least twice with an all-out effort ... but perhaps I am mistaken.

  • #2
    While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not. My take as a guy with 9.9 experience (for 80m :-) ) is that you've only got so many full-power strides in you before something pops.

    Jon Drummond, you still hanging in these parts? What's your take?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by gh
      While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
      Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration.

      I think that it comes right down to the fundamentals of the sport. Each race is a competition. A win is a win is a win, no matter how much you win by. A win in a round gives one no more benefit if its by a large margin or a small margin. There are no awards given in the qualifying rounds. Pretty 'basic' stuff if you ask me.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by malmo
        Originally posted by gh
        While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
        Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration.

        I think that it comes right down to the fundamentals of the sport. Each race is a competition. A win is a win is a win, no matter how much you win by. A win in a round gives one no more benefit if its by a large margin or a small margin. There are no awards given in the qualifying rounds. Pretty 'basic' stuff if you ask me.
        Not really clear what Malmo is saying by referring to "pretty basic stuff." That runners need only do what's necessary to win? If so, again, I go back to my constantly hearing commentators and others talk about conserving energy ... Also, when Tyson Gay almost missed advancing in the Trials b/c he misjudged the finish line, well, again from my unprofessional vantage point, the margin of victory (in real terms) in many of these races is very small (a neck or shoulder of half body).

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by malmo
          Originally posted by gh
          While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
          Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration.

          I think that it comes right down to the fundamentals of the sport. Each race is a competition. A win is a win is a win, no matter how much you win by. A win in a round gives one no more benefit if its by a large margin or a small margin. There are no awards given in the qualifying rounds. Pretty 'basic' stuff if you ask me.
          Mo? when did he start limping in his 9.8-low?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 26mi235
            Mo? when did he start limping in his 9.8-low?
            I don't know, but assuming it was in the last 20 meters, since when is citing the anomalies addressing the hypothesis?

            "but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration."

            Comment


            • #7
              mo was showing distress at ~60m in that race, but he was wearing a ladies' suspender below his knee & assuming he was a "married man" at the time, i assume that suspender was to help with a pre-existing injury rather than guinevere's favor to lancelot in the jousting contest

              pj has quoted that split at 6.33, which i'd assumed a fully fit mo to have completed in ( because by then he was a perfect machine with "matching" 60m & last 40m )

              ~ 9.66s

              Comment


              • #8
                The answer is, of course, self-evident. Even I have done enough racing to understand that there's only so many A+ races in a body over a very short amount of time. The body must rest and repair. In round-running one must run the first 60m (of a 100) pretty much at maximum execution or many things can go wrong, including injury. After that, it's just a matter of 'maintaining/relaxing' whether you go near-PR or let up. If you can ease up just a little more than usual, then the recovery will be 'easier'. Four rounds in the 100 at the OT, even more than the OG or WC, must be debilitating, no matter how many hard runs you've had in practice. In practice one is rarely running at the speeds necessary to move through the OT rounds. Asafa Powell, by his performance and own admission, is not able to process the rounds as efficiently as the others. Perhaps that's just the way he's made and has nothing to do with his preparation.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by malmo
                  Originally posted by gh
                  While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
                  Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration....
                  You're spot-on with that bit of analysis. But I would counter that your average athlete doesn't know that, and acts instintively, and shuts down as soon as feasible (or, as Gay almost learned in Eugene, before it's feasible).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by gh
                    Originally posted by malmo
                    Originally posted by gh
                    While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
                    Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration....
                    You're spot-on with that bit of analysis. But I would counter that your average athlete doesn't know that, and acts instintively, and shuts down as soon as feasible (or, as Gay almost learned in Eugene, before it's feasible).
                    I think that the athletes are much more aware of what's going on than the pundits are. Your 'average" athlete is never in a position to shut down once a race is in hand, because 'average' doesn't make it to the big stage.

                    Just because something is done autonomically doesn't mean it isn't done without forethought or reason. Every race has been rehearsed in the mind thousands of times before. Races have been talked about with their coaches thousands of times. Races have been recapped with their peers thousands of times. All athletes, even average ones understand that it makes sense to let up when a race is in hand for the same reason they'd let up after hitting the tape.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by malmo
                      Originally posted by gh
                      Originally posted by malmo
                      Originally posted by gh
                      While some certainly ease up just for the hot-dog effect, world-class sprinters are always running on the ragged edge between a muscle pull and not.
                      Ostensibly true, but how many times have you ever seen a pull in the last 10-20 meters? They almost always occur at the point of maximum acceleration....
                      You're spot-on with that bit of analysis. But I would counter that your average athlete doesn't know that, and acts instintively, and shuts down as soon as feasible (or, as Gay almost learned in Eugene, before it's feasible).
                      I think that the athletes are much more aware of what's going on than the pundits are. Your 'average" athlete is never in a position to shut down once a race is in hand, because 'average' doesn't make it to the big stage.

                      Just because something is done autonomically doesn't mean it isn't done without forethought or reason. Every race has been rehearsed in the mind thousands of times before. Races have been talked about with their coaches thousands of times. Races have been recapped with their peers thousands of times. All athletes, even average ones understand that it makes sense to let up when a race is in hand for the same reason they'd let up after hitting the tape.
                      Comparing the 100 to say, the 5K, it would seem that easing up and running fairly easy the last 50-100m of a 5K would allow for more benefit that easing up in a 100m race where you let up the last 15m. And, you can only let up so much in a 100.

                      But, is that really true?
                      "Long may you run"- Neil Young

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The sprints entail not just the mechanical movement of the legs, but the chemical nonsense going on within the muscles. Continuing to press on at the end of a race, when it is unnecessary, risks overstressing the energy sources for the muscles, as well as the good ol' endocrine system.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The last half of a race is where the majority of the straining takes place. When driving out of the blocks there is a lot of force that is being driving to the ground. This is a natural movement of the body. Once you come out of your drive phase you are now using more torque, pull (or whatever you want to call it) from your hamstrings. Your stride is now open and the longer you hold this position the more fatigued your legs become.

                          I still race high school kids out on the street for fun every now and then, but I don't stretch or warm up. I only race them for about 30 meters. I drive out, get ahead of them, and by the time 30 meters comes I never had to stand up and run and never really have to worry about pulling a muscle.

                          The conclusion is that there is a heck of a lot of strain in the last half of a 100 meter dash and the longer you hold that upright sprint position forcing your knees up and back the more fatigued you become.

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X