R.I.P. Stuttgart track

[Daisy]

These are remarkable athletes but sheesh!!

You've been watching too many 20-5 scores at your local park :twisted:

[lonewolf]

I had zilch interest in soccer, except for 7 year old grandson's version.
Still don't but dutifully watched Brazil/Boliva play for 45 minutes Sunday while I waited for something else to come on TV. The score was 0-0.
These are remarkable athletes but sheesh!!

[mrbowie]

I spent a year one afternoon watching a soccer game.

[Run DMC]

I am not sure how anyone thinks they can fill stadiums for track when they are so uncomfortable for spectators. I'm not saying "If you build it, they will come.", but "If you don't build it or you tear it down, they definitely won't come."

Home Depot Center Track is a crap facility for spectators. Top of a hill in the wind and sun with no shade, aluminum bleacher seating barely suitable for a High School. The track itself is nice, but who wants to bake in the sun and walk up steps that clank and shake and you set down your drink and it falls through to the ground? Conversely, the Home Depot Soccer arena has a permanent structure with contoured individual seats with armrests, and a cover. Hmmmm...

Some good facilities for spectators and athletes:
Mt. SAC - in a wind protected bowl, great weather, unfortunately no shade.
Duke U. - similar to Mt. SAC. The track is slated to be removed.
Hayward field - permanent structure with cover for spectators.

Can't speak to European venues, but many look on TV to be much more comfortable than the temporary structures at most US venues.

[croflash]

german football is not the same as it was more than 10 years ago...

2002, germany had a soft path thru the elimination phase...

2006, at home...

brasil and argentina crank out world class talent at a rate well beyond germany..

the germany of old always had top end talent, but there isn't as much as there used to be..

the transfer market defines value to me....

bayern goes get toni and ribery, because the german system is not producing talent at that level, or enough talent at that level...

i'm NOT saying germany isn't GOOD, i'm more saying they aren't GREAT like they used to be...

German football was a lot worse 10 years ago because many of those responsible for the success were resting on their laurels. They missed a lot of developments in international football and are still catching up, however the results are certainly indicating that the trend is positive.

As far as clubs, the difference compared to England is that the club has to hold at least 51 %, which is the reason why you don't see Abramovichs in Germany. You also have to meet a lot of criteria to get a license from the DFL, also a difference to Spain or Italy.

Overall it's getting better again, the low point was passed several years ago.

Is the track at Cologne indeed gone? I think they had 60,000 in there for the Weltklasse in '84, shortly after the Games. (Yes, Cologne and Zurich both had the same name of their meet.)

I remember being there in '86, the year of Donkova's double WR performance. (Thank goodness she got that second WR, right GH?) And, as I recall, a near-miss by Aouita in the 3000 - my feeble memory says 7:32.23?

What about Dusseldorf, home of the memorable inaugural World Cup?

Yes, both are gone for a while now.

[az2004]

german football is not the same as it was more than 10 years ago...

2002, germany had a soft path thru the elimination phase...

2006, at home...

brasil and argentina crank out world class talent at a rate well beyond germany..

the germany of old always had top end talent, but there isn't as much as there used to be..

the transfer market defines value to me....

bayern goes get toni and ribery, because the german system is not producing talent at that level, or enough talent at that level...

i'm NOT saying germany isn't GOOD, i'm more saying they aren't GREAT like they used to be...

[cigar95]

Is the track at Cologne indeed gone? I think they had 60,000 in there for the Weltklasse in '84, shortly after the Games. (Yes, Cologne and Zurich both had the same name of their meet.)

I remember being there in '86, the year of Donkova's double WR performance. (Thank goodness she got that second WR, right GH?) And, as I recall, a near-miss by Aouita in the 3000 - my feeble memory says 7:32.23?

What about Dusseldorf, home of the memorable inaugural World Cup?

[trackrebel]

herta berlin isn't a major player in the bundesliga, so the brlin olympic track ain't going anywhere...

personally, i think the german game of soccer is slowly deteriorating, with fewer top notch players, and performances in champions league not what they used to be..

after giving up 3 goals t finland, the germans are looking to naturalize and american, neven subotic....

and there are rumors bayern munich is looking to acquire landon donovan once mls season concludes

this is also wrong....our National Team is playing better since 2005 again....we were 3rd at Worlds and Second at Euros....big boosts for the fans, TV stations everything...

Bayern Munich is back in the Champions League....and if they come fullforce with the talent they have....and all the injured players....they could get far....then there´s Schalke, Bremen and on....a few others good team on the UEFA Cup....German Football is going nowhere....Plus....youthwork has been done very well since 2000 and now they reap the fruits....Marin....a very young guy scored twice in National Games already....Schweinsteiger and Podolski are still younger than 24....then You Helmes and on and on...Plus the Under 18 or under-21 team just became Euro Champion....so the future looks quite bright these days...

[trackrebel]

Eldrick is right that (fortunately) most of the tracks in the former GDR are still alive and well - certainly those in East Berlin, Erfurt, Jena, Potsdam, Dresden, Neubrandenburg and Chemnitz (Karl-Marx-Stadt), although the largest and most impressive arena in Germany - potentially in the whole of Europe - was regrettably turned into a football-only stadium for the 2006 World Cup. I refer, of course, to the Zentralstadion In Leipzig (capacity 110,000), site of the legendary Spartakiade and massive Sports Festivals in the "good old days".

The primary reason is that the football teams in the eastern part of the country do not enjoy the same level of success as those in the west, and therefore there is not the same amount of money to be invested. However, it has to be said that the former GDR citizens still prefer the 'traditional' Olympic sports, and therefore T&F in the east still has a higher status than football. Moreover, the former GDR residents seem prepared to defend their stadia more robustly than the 'West Germans', where €€€ and capitalism has more influence.

sorry...but that´s plain wrong....Eastern Germans love Soccer as much as West Germans....they might like Track more than the Western Germans....but they don´t like it more than Football....

[Rob]

Agreed, but Bayern Munich has so much money that they could afford to move out of the Olympic Stadium and recently set up home in a brand new purpose-build stadium on the northern outskirts of the city (Allianz Arena), leaving the poor old Olympic stadium with a less-than-certain future. It still hosts the occasional rock concert (whenever a touring band can demand such a capacity), but the only thing keeping it from closing is that the entire Olympic park (including the former Gymnastics Hall & Swimming Pool) is a protected site. Having said that, the management company that runs the place (Olympiapark GmbH) are not having any easy time justiying the finanacial outlay that keeps it all in top condition (the stadium having been recently re-roofed, for example).

Football is killing track in Germany, as far as international stadia are concerned.

[az2004]

herta berlin isn't a major player in the bundesliga, so the brlin olympic track ain't going anywhere...

personally, i think the german game of soccer is slowly deteriorating, with fewer top notch players, and performances in champions league not what they used to be..

after giving up 3 goals t finland, the germans are looking to naturalize and american, neven subotic....

and there are rumors bayern munich is looking to acquire landon donovan once mls season concludes

[Smoke]

the weather killed the crowd. remember it was 50 something degrees and raining.

conversely brussels was packed, 50k strong. amazing

[Powell]

Re: R.I.P. Stuttgart track

Agreed. I think almost nobody sees the WAF as a championship, it's a two day meet with the difference that the IAAF is the host.

Yes, but still, it was a meet with around 20 individual Oly champions in it. That kind of attendance is disappointing given the quality of the fields.

[croflash]

Re: R.I.P. Stuttgart track

Sadly, the number of spectators during the weekend actually suggests they made the right decision :?

Is that really all that indicative, I wonder? We're talking about a "fake championship" meet that few really care about, in the middle of September, way after fan interest has come and gone...

Fine, the championship status of the WAF is somewhat doubtful, but even if you look at it as just another invitational - how many meets have fields of this quality?

Agreed. I think almost nobody sees the WAF as a championship, it's a two day meet with the difference that the IAAF is the host.

[Powell]

Re: R.I.P. Stuttgart track

Sadly, the number of spectators during the weekend actually suggests they made the right decision :?

Is that really all that indicative, I wonder? We're talking about a "fake championship" meet that few really care about, in the middle of September, way after fan interest has come and gone...

Fine, the championship status of the WAF is somewhat doubtful, but even if you look at it as just another invitational - how many meets have fields of this quality?