American 3 mile record, 6 mile record?

[lovetorun]

I know Matt Tegencamp has the American 2-mile record (8:07.07), but I am at a loss to remember who has the official 3 mile record...and, for that matter, the 6 mile record.

The only thing that comes to mind is Billy Mill's (and Gerry Lindgren) 27:11.6 in San Diego in the national champs of 1965, and I remember Pre and Frank Shorter ran the 3 mile in the low 12:50's. But I know much faster times have been recorded in 10,000m and 5000m races.

[huntinwr]

3-mile and 6-mile records

Since the 3 and 6 are no longer recognized distances, it's a moot point.

However, I believe the last recognized records were Prefontaine, 12:51.4 against Shorter in 1974 and 26:51.8 (enroute to 10k AR of 27:43.6 on 27 April 1974 in Eugene.

Of course, the current ARs of 12:58.21 and 27:13.98 would be intrinsically superior to both marks.

[gh]

It should be the dream of all American distance runners to break those records... at the metric distance!

[huntinwr]

American 3-mile, 6-mile records

Here's to the dream becoming a reality. Although probably a ways off yet. I think we could see new 5k and 10k records this year, though. Rupp is poised for a breakthrough at 10 and Lagat might get the 5.

[Master Po]

Re: American 3-mile, 6-mile records

Here's to the dream becoming a reality. Although probably a ways off yet. I think we could see new 5k and 10k records this year, though. Rupp is poised for a breakthrough at 10 and Lagat might get the 5.

Should Lagat accomplish this feat -- and I'm not saying he won't or can't, he's a great runner -- he would be the oldest runner to run 5000 this fast, or to go sub-13:00. Using the dob's and dates of performances on pela2's lists (and hoping this doesn't get diverted into a "how old are they really?" jag, which seems pointless -- these are the data we have), almost all sub 13:00 have been in their 20s, of course. Lagat was 30 and 31 yo when he ran his 12:59 performances, and several (e.g, Geb, Tergat, B. Limo, et al.) have also been 30-31yo. But very few sub 13:00 older than that, and only one guy older than 32yo.

Here are the oldest athletes to accomplish sub-13:00 performances:

John Kibowen (21 april 69) 12:54.07 (31 August 03) = 34 y 4 mo
Kibowen also 12:58.61 at age 33, and 12:59.97 at age 32.

Dieter Baumann 12:54.70, 32yo
Brahim Lahlafi 12:56.18, 32yo
Paul Bitok 12:58.94, 32 yo

So, only Kibowen has run as fast as Lagat would need to in order to get the AR at such an "advanced" age. But Lagat certainly seems to have great longevity at a very high level, so it may be possible for him to do it.

[huntinwr]

American 3 and 6 mile records

Yeah, you tend to forget how old Lagat. I just did. What is he, 34?

Anyway, he did already run 13:03 this year in late May. So assuming he wasn't in absolute peak form yet, a sub 12:58 seems doable.

[imaginative]

Also see http://www.apulanta.fi/matti/yu/aars_Men.html#5000m
for age records.

[Brian]

Re: American 3-mile, 6-mile records

Here's to the dream becoming a reality. Although probably a ways off yet. I think we could see new 5k and 10k records this year, though. Rupp is poised for a breakthrough at 10 and Lagat might get the 5.

I agree re: Rupp. But not this year.

He's had a long year with his NCAA campaigns and I think the plan may be for him to get more international experience at the Worlds and also work on closing well in that race. But as far as a balls-out fast time over 10,000m., I think that will have to wait until the culmination of a planned 2010 season, probably at Van Damme (with an AR try over 5,000m. at Zurich 10-14 days beforehand).

That's what I'd have him do, anyway. And I think Salazar/Lananna are both pretty keen on Rupp resting up before training (you have to do that, remember) for a low 27:00 time. He'll probably try for a 5,000m. PR before the Worlds, though; good sharpening and not as killer as an ultra-hard 10,000m.


I can see Lagat (different training/racing situation--no NCAA seasons) busting a fast one just before the Worlds. Maybe an AR.

[lovetorun]

Re: 3-mile and 6-mile records

[quote="huntinwr"]Since the 3 and 6 are no longer recognized distances, it's a moot point

I agree it's a mute point, but I was just curious, since, back in my competitive day, we were still running the 3 and the 6, although metric was starting to come in.

[cigar95]

If you want an even more obscure question - what are the *women's* quasi-ARs at 3m and 6m? I can't recall seeing a mark reported, even as an en route time, for either distance.

This might be a question for Alan Sigmon.

[kuha]

For all that talk in the recent past about "Millenium" records and wiping the record book clean, etc., I'd love to see the U.S. re-recognize the 3 and 6 mile distances for national record purposes and to throw in the 4 and 5 mile also (and, while we're on this revisionist roll, the 600y and 1000y, too!!). It would be fun to see those records chipped away at for at least a few years...

[AthleticsInBritain]

If you want an even more obscure question - what are the *women's* quasi-ARs at 3m and 6m? I can't recall seeing a mark reported, even as an en route time, for either distance.

This might be a question for Alan Sigmon.

I don't think there would be any 3 or 6 mile races for women prior to going metric would there? Women running 10k only really started in the 80s and 5k in the 90s, although there may have been 3 mile races for women. Ok, now I'm going to have to check for Britain too, as we still had the 3 and 6 mile races definitely into the 60s, if not the early 70s. I can't imagine any races being laid on for women though. :?

[lovetorun]

In the summers of 1968, 69 officials of all comers meets in Costa Mesa, CA set up a series (I think there were 3 races) of 6 mile races to give H.S. age runners a shot on getting on the national list for the event. I ran in 2 of them...24 laps around the track...Costa Mesa track must have been 440 yards back then. Again, this is before things really went metric.

[cigar95]

I don't think there would be any 3 or 6 mile races for women prior to going metric would there?

That's exactly why the "records" would be so obscure. I have never heard of a top-class race in America for women at either 3m or 6m, but I would be surprised to discover that there were no races for women at any level at those distances.

Neither do I have any recall of 3m or 6m splits in top-class races at 5km and 10km.

If we wanted to seriously dig up the best times, my hunch is that the records would be the existing 5km and 10km records, since marks achieved at longer distances can be considered for records at shorter distances. (Unless, of course, you're the NFSHSAA!)

[Alan Sigmon]

You rang?

Re American Women's 3M and 6M records/bests:

I can't state anything authoritatively, but I found these:

5 June 82, Eugene, Prefontaine Classic--Mary Decker Tabb 5000m WR 15:08.26. 3 Miles en route 14:38.7.

16 July 82, Eugene, All-Comers--Mary Decker Tabb 10,000m WR 31:35.3. 6 Miles en route 30:35 (of course inferior to the current 10,000 AR).

A good estimate of Shalane Flanagan's 3M in her 14:44.80 AR of '07 would be 14:15.3 [14.10.4 at 4800m, and a 34.4 last 200].

In her AR 10,000 of 30:22.2 she was about 29:24.0 at 6M [based on a last lap of 68.0, with a penultimate 200 of 34.7].

And there were definitely some 3M races for women back in the good old days.
For example, Peg Neppel (Iowa St) ran a "WR" 15:41.6 to win the 3M at the 1976 AIAW Championships (May 14, Manhattan, Kans.)