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  • Gleason
    replied
    I agree. Lagat's sub - 13:00 ability at 5K should have tolerated three 800 races in four days. He would have a week to travel to Europe, do a few one hour runs and a serious workout before Lausanne.

    A meet exists where the top six athletes compete at the end of the season--WAF, but it will end in 2010 due to a lack of interest by athletes and fans.

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  • 110hedgeNYC
    replied
    that will be interesting to see. I just would have liked to watch him work his way through the heats in Eugene. It could have made for a more interesting final. I would have thought that running 3 800's over 4 days would have benefited Lagat's training - and would have given the fans a bit of a show as a bonus.

    otherwise, I have no complaints. I like the WC bye system. It allows nations that are strong in an event to take 4, which is closer to what it should be.

    really, the WC should consider opening up to something like 6 as a max from one country, in order to get the absolutate best of world there.

    Perhaps there could be.. ok, this is a new thread..

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    I think that gh wrote that Lagat will run a 100% attempt at a fast 800 in Lausanne on July 7.

    Leave a comment:


  • 110hedgeNYC
    replied
    I thought this guy's article was dumb. Period.

    It was a lot of huff and puff; not much understanding.

    Plus, I agree with some others on this thread that it can be interesting and fun to watch athletes cross over to other events (e.g., was interesting to see what Clemont could do in the flat 400; Wariner in the 200; one good heat from Gay was enough for me - given what he went through in Eugene last year).

    My only dissapointment on this front was Lagat: I would have enjoyed watching Lagat mix things up in the 800. I thought he was going to go as far as he could and use a series of 800's to sharpen up his speed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    Attendance was 38,451--a record. I think that the fans enjoyed seeing Gay run a 100% effort in his 100 heat, Clement finish third in the 400, Lagat trying the 800 and Wariner trying the 200.

    Considering the global recession this suggests that it is probable that only the journalist and Logan disliked athletes choosing different events.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    Re: Fans deserve better!

    Originally posted by Gleason
    Originally posted by Daisy
    Originally posted by Gleason
    They aren't "training through the trials."
    From another thread.
    Originally posted by EPelle
    "I felt alright," Lagat said, quite winded after the race. "It's hard to run the 800m. I can't remember the last time I ran one, although I did run a 1000m last year in 2:16. But I needed to work on my speed and this was a good training run for me."
    Lagat, who said he plans on doubling at the World Championships, will not run in the next round. He said he was planning on leaving the meet, returning to his hotel to pack, flying out of Eugene and heading to Germany where he will train and next compete.
    Front-page link on Universal Sports thursday wrap-up.
    There is a difference between "training through" and "training run." In 2007 Wariner ran 20.35 to finish fourth behind Martin at USAT&F. Martin went on to finish fourth at Osaka. Wariner probably would have finished fifth at Osaka if the U.S. would have been allowed to enter four 200 sprinters and the schedule would have allowed it. A "training run" for Wariner is a career highlight for 99.99% of elite athletes.

    I don't know if "Daisy" has ever run or coached, so here is an example of "training through."
    IF Lagat's 800 heat is on June 25, "training through" could be this:
    June 24
    1. Two miles in 15 minutes warmup.
    2. 4 x 100 meters in 13 - 14 seconds with a 100 meters jog to prepare for:
    3. 20 x 400 meters at 60 seconds with a 100 meters jog in 60 seconds.
    4. One mile warmdown in eight minutes.
    About 10 miles total.

    I saw no example of "training through."
    Here is the quote that "EPelle" requested. I'm sorry for duplication that used bandwith. :cry:

    Leave a comment:


  • Daisy
    replied
    All I meant was that they are using it for training. If 'training run' is the preferred term then go with that. Personally, I think this is exactly what they should be doing.

    Leave a comment:


  • EPelle
    replied
    Originally posted by Gleason
    Wariner probably would have finished FIFTH in the 200 at Osaka. See my posting at 9:17pm June 26.
    Fifth in Osaka doesn't qualify the potential Osaka race as a training race -- the current topic being debated (training through the trials). This appears to simply be a matter of interpretation and semantics. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to look up a post made at 21.27 yesterday; we are nine time zones separated, and I haven't an idea to which thread you may have posted. Lagat, in so many words, stated he got in a good (speed) training session, running 800m (the "half-distance" of 1.500m). Isn't that what Wariner (200m, half the distance of 400m) and Felix (100m, half the distance of 200m) are doing?

    He is an elite 200 sprinter. He won the Texas AAAAA 400 & 200 in 2002.
    Gleason, by inference, winning the high school 200m/400m state championship has become the definer here? What exact criteria has made Wariner the elite 200m sprinter, and why would 99,99% of other elite sprinters have been happy to have made a career mark out of a training run by Wariner?

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    Originally posted by EPelle
    You're absolutely correct in that it wasn't a meet he's trained through, it was about a training run. The entire point was that he used the race as a training ground to better his speed.

    After the "Thousands of athletes are "elite." " comment, I'm unsure what the flip-flopping of events and the supposed tie-in to attendance had to do with 1) elite athletes being inferior to Wariner, and 2) Lagat's training run. With respect to your comment, where are there "thousands" of 200m sprinters (the event to which the Wariner comment was linked) who are the best or most skilled members of this group (19,30-20,19)? Wariner is barely even in the elite of his class.
    Wariner probably would have finished FIFTH in the 200 at Osaka. See my posting at 9:17pm June 26. He is an elite 200 sprinter. He won the Texas AAAAA 400 & 200 in 2002.

    Leave a comment:


  • EPelle
    replied
    You're absolutely correct in that it wasn't a meet he's trained through, it was about a training run. The entire point was that he used the race as a training ground to better his speed.

    After the "Thousands of athletes are "elite." " comment, I'm unsure what the flip-flopping of events and the supposed tie-in to attendance had to do with 1) elite athletes being inferior to Wariner, and 2) Lagat's training run. With respect to your comment, where are there "thousands" of 200m sprinters (the event to which the Wariner comment was linked) who are the best or most skilled members of this group (19,30-20,19)? Wariner is barely even in the elite of his class.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    Re: Fans deserve better!

    Originally posted by EPelle
    Originally posted by Gleason
    IF Lagat's 800 heat is on June 25, "training through" could be this:
    June 24
    1. Two miles in 15 minutes warmup.
    2. 4 x 100 meters in 13 - 14 seconds with a 100 meters jog to prepare for:
    3. 20 x 400 meters at 60 seconds with a 100 meters jog in 60 seconds.
    4. One mile warmdown in eight minutes.
    About 10 miles total.
    I saw no example of "training through."
    Gleason, I wouldn't suppose you would ever find this type of example of "traning through" for Lagat, as he lends one day a week to the track on average. I've never read that Lagat, despite what low-level difficulty he may face in a race of no consequence, has ever trained hard the day before he competed.
    The purpose of this 800m was for speed work. Point #3, 20x400m at 60 pace with 60s jog between, dulls his legs - it doesn't add speed.
    Perhaps the Wariner comment was hyperbole, but can you state how his training runs are career highlights for 99,99% of elite athletes? By nature of the word, aren't they already in a class by themselves?
    Thanks for proving my point. No defending champion "trained through." Elite athletes are state high school champions even in states such as Wyoming or those who letter in a Divison 1 t&f program. Thousands of athletes are "elite."

    That is the problem with the "Rabble-Rouser" journalist. Newspapers are dying because writers are trying to call attention to their dopey ideas rather than informing readers. IF Gay hadn't promised to sprint 100% in the 100, Clement had chosen 400H, Lagat had chosen 1500, attendance would have been less than 8500. That was a great first day attendance. In 2007 it was 5480 without a Global Recession, but journalists only want to report bad news.

    Leave a comment:


  • EPelle
    replied
    Re: Fans deserve better!

    Originally posted by Gleason
    IF Lagat's 800 heat is on June 25, "training through" could be this:
    June 24
    1. Two miles in 15 minutes warmup.
    2. 4 x 100 meters in 13 - 14 seconds with a 100 meters jog to prepare for:
    3. 20 x 400 meters at 60 seconds with a 100 meters jog in 60 seconds.
    4. One mile warmdown in eight minutes.
    About 10 miles total.

    I saw no example of "training through."
    Gleason, I wouldn't suppose you would ever find this type of example of "traning through" for Lagat, as he lends one day a week to the track on average. I've never read that Lagat, despite what low-level difficulty he may face in a race of no consequence, has ever trained hard the day before he competed.

    The purpose of this 800m was for speed work. Point #3, 20x400m at 60 pace with 60s jog between, dulls his legs - it doesn't add speed.

    Perhaps the Wariner comment was hyperbole, but can you state how his training runs are career highlights for 99,99% of elite athletes? By nature of the word, aren't they already in a class by themselves?

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    My pleasure. Rorick and I are former T&FN statisticians, but I referred to his response for "A" and "B" info on men's 5000 and women's TJ! This is complicated.

    Leave a comment:


  • Brian
    replied
    [quote="Gleason"]I'm sorry, but you are wrong. /quote]


    Sincere thanks for quick response.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gleason
    replied
    I'm sorry, but you are wrong. In 2007, Felix finished fourth in the 100 at USAT&F. She could have run at Osaka, but she gave her place to Lewis--the fifth placer. In the 200 because Felix won, USAT&F fourth placer LaShaunte'a Moore ran at Osaka and made the final.

    It is confusing at WCh. Nations are allowed to enter THREE athletes in each event if:
    1. Three have the "A" standard or
    2. Two have the "A" standard and one has the "B" standard

    Wildcards are defending champions who are additional to the above.

    I'll skip the TWO athletes rules.

    Leave a comment:

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