double decathalon

[AS]

Re: double decathalon

Detmer also set a world record for the highest decathlon score ever posted as part of a double decathlon competition. He racked up an incredible 7,741 points in the 10 traditional decathlon disciplines on Friday and Saturday.

That 7741 is pretty impressive when you look at Detmer's SRs over past few years:

2010 8090 Marburg 08/08/2010
2009 7892 Marburg 09/08/2009
2008 7861 Manhattan, KS 03/08/2008
2007 7616 FILDERSTADT 19/08/2007
2006 7536 Sacramento, CA 08/06/2006

http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/biographie ... index.html

Nice comparison of past three records by events here:
http://www.decathlon2000.ee/eng/2805/

[Halfmiler2]

Re: double decathalon

The 200H is not longer a record event, but the 1K, 2K, 3K, Mile, and 56 lb. wt. are outdoor record events, so pick two of them. (I think the 56 lb. wt. is a USATF record event but no longer an IAAF outdoor record event. The others are recognized by both.)

[Powell]

Re: double decathalon

why are the 200 hurdles included?

There are only 18 individual events on the Olympic program (if you exclude those held outside the stadium), so to get to 20, they had to include two extras - 3000 and 200H

[Powell]

Re: double decathalon

Why "double decathlon"? Sounds analogous to calling decathlon double pentathlon. All logic says it should be called "icosathlon".

Icosathlon would be over four days (pent 1, deca 2, ... iso 4). Here, the even is doubled each day.

Not at all. The name icosathlon only says it consists of 20 events, not over what time they are held. You could do the 10 events in 1 day, or in ten, and it would still be called decathlon.

[26mi235]

Re: double decathalon

Why "double decathlon"? Sounds analogous to calling decathlon double pentathlon. All logic says it should be called "icosathlon".

Icosathlon would be over four days (pent 1, deca 2, ... iso 4). Here, the even is doubled each day.

I did comment on this somewhere. His decathlon subset is actually a pretty decent score of about 7700, I think. This guy was a walk-on at Wisconsin and did not do his first multis until probably his junior year -- then was fourth indoors NCAA (setting a Hept record in the 1000 at 2:29--since broken by Beach, I think) and second outdoors where he past a number of guys with a 4:04, which he says he ran conservatively going out 'slow' (upper-60s for the first third or more?) because he wanted to beat some guys to get second and thinks he might have gone under 4:00.

[mikli]

Re: double decathalon

Why "double decathlon"? Sounds analogous to calling decathlon double pentathlon. All logic says it should be called "icosathlon".

[AS]

Re: double decathalon

It seems to have gone uncommented-upon but Joe Detmer smashed the record for this event a month or so ago:

The decathlon All-American during his collegiate career at Wisconsin tallied 14,571 points in his 20 events, shattering Kip Janvrin's world double decathlon record by 386 points.

Detmer also set a world record for the highest decathlon score ever posted as part of a double decathlon competition. He racked up an incredible 7,741 points in the 10 traditional decathlon disciplines on Friday and Saturday.

http://www.libertyflames.com/index.cfm? ... ewsID=5865

Results are on a pdf at the link, but here's an attempt of mine to cut and paste Detmer's results for you all:

100m 10.93
LJ 7.30
200mH 24.25
SP 12.27
5000m 18:25.3
800m 02:02.2
HJ 1.98
400m 50.43
HT 31.82
3000mSt 11:22.5
110mH 15.01
DT 40.73
200m 22.58
PV 4.85
3000m 10:26.0
400mH 53.83
JT 51.95
1500m 04:26.7
TJ 13.67
10000m 40:27.3

That's my new nomination for performance of the year!!!

[hammer forever]

Re: double decathalon

why are the 200 hurdles included?

[abinferno]

Re: double decathalon

Well, I guess we'll have to just disagree. Although it's not an Olympic event, I have a great deal of respect for someone who completes a double decathlon, because it is incredibly grueling and arduous. This is along the same lines as those ultra 100mile runs, or other events of the same ilk. It may not be an elite Olympic event, but it is an incredible self-test of athletic ability.

[decafan]

Re: double decathalon

No, you're missing the point. The double decathlon is not for
>conventional decathletes, it's not supposed to be. Of course Dan O'Brien
>wouldn't have a prayer in the double decathlon. That's like saying the 10,000m
>doesn't count as a real race because El G doesn't compete in it. It is a
>totally different event. I reiterate, I believe Janvrin has the best
>combination of endurance, proven by the double decathlon events such as
>10,000m, 5,000m, etc., and strength, proven by the conventional decathlon
>events like throwing and jumping. You could make the same argument against the
>regular decathlon that they're not good enough to compete in one event
>individually, so they had to put together 10 events to prove they had the best
>overall athletic balance. Well, the double decathlon is simply an extension of
>that, only now it involves the grueling endurance events. Janvrin's
>accomplishment here warrants respect, whether you choose to acknowledge it or
>not. Guess how many football fans don't acknowledge any track and field
>accomplishments, well you're showing the same bias right here.

OK Mr. Firebelly, the last time I checked, the 10,000m and the decathlon were Olympic events. So saying the double decathlon is a silly little joke played by recreational decathletes is nothing at all like saying the 10,000m isn't a real event, or that the decathlon is for athletes no good in any 1 event.
Furthermore, the double decathlon is NOT an extension of the decathlon. It is a recreational event created by pseudo-decathletes who were frustrated by their lack of fast twitch muscle fibers. That is why they added all endurance events and not more speed/power events.
And you are reaching with the "football bias" remark. I have spent my life in this sport as an athlete and now coach. If the double decathlon was an Olympic event and world class athletes competed at it, you wouldn't hear a peep out of me. I would pull up a chair and enjoy the show. Until that day, the event will logically remain a joke.
Your last name isn't Shinnick, is it?

[abinferno]

Re: double decathalon

You're missing the point. And the fact that you
>claim to be a decathlete is no more to the point than if you were a
>bellydancer. No real decathlete would train for this silly event because it's
>not a real event. And I hate to burst your Janvrin bubble, but his balance is
>very out-of-balance in the decathlon. The tables play to the speed/power
>events. Ask Dan O'Brien or Chris Huffins or tom Pappas why they don't train as
>hard for the 1500m as Janvrin did. If you want to know whether the double
>decathlon warrants our respect or not, simply look at how many of the top
>decathletes actually waste their time competing in it. And with all due
>respect to Kip Janvrin, he doesn't count. History won't remember him for his
>greatness. Only his longevity.

No, you're missing the point. The double decathlon is not for conventional decathletes, it's not supposed to be. Of course Dan O'Brien wouldn't have a prayer in the double decathlon. That's like saying the 10,000m doesn't count as a real race because El G doesn't compete in it. It is a totally different event. I reiterate, I believe Janvrin has the best combination of endurance, proven by the double decathlon events such as 10,000m, 5,000m, etc., and strength, proven by the conventional decathlon events like throwing and jumping. You could make the same argument against the regular decathlon that they're not good enough to compete in one event individually, so they had to put together 10 events to prove they had the best overall athletic balance. Well, the double decathlon is simply an extension of that, only now it involves the grueling endurance events. Janvrin's accomplishment here warrants respect, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not. Guess how many football fans don't acknowledge any track and field accomplishments, well you're showing the same bias right here.

[No Name]

Re: double decathalon

In any case, I think it would be foolish for an elite decathlete to compete in one of these due to the high risk of injury.

[kuha]

Re: double decathalon

Bingo. The truth hurts.

[decafan]

Re: double decathalon

>I'm a decathlete, and I think it takes a tremendous amount of guts to do one of
>these. I'd bet no one could even approach Janvrin's score right now. He has a
>better balance of endurance and strength than probably anyone else on the
>planet. That is one incredible test of merit, not just for recreational
>athletes.

You're missing the point. And the fact that you claim to be a decathlete is no more to the point than if you were a bellydancer. No real decathlete would train for this silly event because it's not a real event. And I hate to burst your Janvrin bubble, but his balance is very out-of-balance in the decathlon. The tables play to the speed/power events. Ask Dan O'Brien or Chris Huffins or tom Pappas why they don't train as hard for the 1500m as Janvrin did. If you want to know whether the double decathlon warrants our respect or not, simply look at how many of the top decathletes actually waste their time competing in it. And with all due respect to Kip Janvrin, he doesn't count. History won't remember him for his greatness. Only his longevity.

[abinferno]

Re: double decathalon

I'm a decathlete, and I think it takes a tremendous amount of guts to do one of these. I'd bet no one could even approach Janvrin's score right now. He has a better balance of endurance and strength than probably anyone else on the planet. That is one incredible test of merit, not just for recreational athletes.