A weak year for men's HJ? [split]

[gh]

both! which is the point I was getting at.

Even if you're only at 2.30 at this point, it's not totally off the wall to think that you might earn a medal (at a higher height than that, of course).

[Powell]

I don't see I used the word "depth" anywhere. This thread was about it being a weak year, with the possibility (not probability) of a Russian 1-2-3.

But you used the number of people over 2.30 as a measure of quality of the season. That led me to think you were talking of depth, not just of the medal contenders.

[gm33]

compared to the 80s it is weak
but then you had Sotomayor, Sjoberg, Paklin, Avdeenko, Mogenburg...

still, i think it's in decent level, certainly not worse than last year...

[gh]

I agree - at the very top it's much weaker than it used to be. But gh, in his initial post, talked about depth.

I don't see I used the word "depth" anywhere. This thread was about it being a weak year, with the possibility (not probability) of a Russian 1-2-3.

All my statements were couched the from the frame of reference of who was going to be on the medal stand (or, by extension, who would end up in a top-10 formchart, although I didn't specifically state that).

From that viewpoint, "depth" is certainly not there. As specifically cited, a guy with four meets over 2.30 is considered "hot" at this point. The top end of the pyramid doesn't have much of a point.

[mikli]

Also statistically 2008 was not a good year if one uses mid-late 80s / early 90s as a reference. As Powell pointed out above, if 2008 was a bad year, then the whole 2000s was, and that actually extends back to mid 90s.

[Powell]

I agree - at the very top it's much weaker than it used to be. But gh, in his initial post, talked about depth.

[Dietmar239]

Weak is a relative term. Statistically, it may have been pretty good. However, when you you're used to your Sjoberg, Sotomayor, Thranhardt, Paklin, these current results kind of pale. How many times has 2.40m been cleared since Soto? Voronin, Holm, Ukhov. That's it. It's just not exciting anymore.

[Powell]

Also, 2008 had the most jumpers at 2.30 or above of all years since 2000 (31, compared to 30 in 2007 and not more than 25 in any other year), as well the most at 2.27 or above (2.26 and 2.25, too).

[mikli]

In terms of top20 averages, 2008 was not a bad year, and 2009 is likely not becoming bad either, if one makes comparisons to the 2000s:

top20 averages outdoor:

2000: 2.330
2001: 2.323
2002: 2.320
2003: 2.318
2004: 2.320
2005: 2.326
2006: 2.322
2007: 2.321
2008: 2.325
2009 (so far): 2.316

1988 is still the best year with 2.356

more throughout data here: http://mb.trackandfieldnews.com/discuss ... hp?t=31194

[lapsus]

OK, so you've proved that '08 sucked too! :-)

So did '07 if you consider the outdoor world best that year! And still it feels to me like there are more jumpers capable of 2.40 heights these days that in the early 2000s.

Well, this year it is more like "jumper" than "jumpers".

[Powell]

If 2008 did, so did all other years in the last decade.

[gh]

OK, so you've proved that '08 sucked too! :-)

[Powell]

It has a lot to do with the WCh A and B qualifiers. They were raised by a cm this year, and most top meets have height progression which matches them.

Last year, 31 men cleared 2.30 outdoors, but only 14 did 2.31 or higher. There was only one with a SB of 2.29 and one with 2.28, but 22 at 2.27 (which was the Olympic B qualifier).

This year, 14 men cleared 2.31, so if you use that, rather than 2.30, as the benchmark, 2008 has already been matched. The difference is that there are only 3 men at 2.30 this season. Likewise, 34 men have already cleared 2.28 - that's one more than in 2008, but if you use 2.27 as the limit, the number is only 36 this year compared to 53 last year.

[gh]

In a quick peek at the IAAF lists, all of 17 men have combined to jump 2.30 or better 30 times this year.

Throw out an American and two Russians who won't be in Berlin and there are only 14 guys at 2.30 or better to consider for a formchart. Indeed weak.

[gh]

Yeah, as Dietmar noted, Bába is "hot" right now. But his outdoor season consists of this (4 meets over 2.30):

2.15 1)Ostrava 05/23
2.17 1)Danek-Turnov 05/26
2.22 =2)Pfingst-Rehlingen 06/01 1. Riedel.
2.31 2)Thessaloníki 06/10 1. Dmitrik.
2.31 2)Euro Teams 06/20 1. Krymarenko.
2.26 1)Lausanne GP 07/07
2.31 2)Athens GP 07/13 1. Ukhov.
2.33 1)London GP 07/25

Somewhere along the line, somebody repealed the Law of Gravity. No wait, I got that backwards; they rewrote it, and doubled it!