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  • cacique
    replied
    i think the rules in gymnastics were changed at one point. i think the USSR did abuse the rules in that respect in the past , in gymnastics, and not just in athletics.

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  • unclezadok
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by cacique
    Originally posted by Alexm
    Is there any possibility that Bettie Wade will be 'persuaded' to drop out, or 'picks up an injury', so that Fountain can take her place in the heptatlon for Berlin?
    what is this? the soviet union? GDR?

    weren't those 2 countries famous for using a gymnast (or swimmer) in qualifying, only to have her suddenly 'injured' before the final and replaced by a well rested superstar?
    A country can use any method it wants to pick a team, in any sport, as long as the qualifying standards are met. Some countries actually use methods that result in the strongest possible team. .

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  • Pego
    replied
    Originally posted by tm71
    As we all know, nothing happened and Cannon went to Seoul, as he earned.

    and what did cannon do in seoul ? bombed !

    anyway besides the kidding, someone who barely made the B standard and most B standards are VERY WEAK, has no chance of doing anything in the worlds or olympics other than being back in the pack, way back in the pack.
    btw there have been a lot of instances when people gave up their spots example quincy watts in 1991 gave up his spot in the 400 meters (i think it went to valmon or everett) and just run the relay. i am sure there have been others...
    Your assessment is correct, but that was not the point. All I am saying is that I am not aware, the US athletic federation would ever have replaced an athlete that qualified for the team in OT by a star, regardless of their chances.

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  • Powell
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by Bruce Kritzler
    In the 1980 Moscow Olympics (before relay teams had free substitutions) USSR ran a "B" team in 4x4 prelims. They all claimed medical reasons for not running the final, and were miraculously replaced by the "A" team.
    Yes, I'm familiar with that incident, thank you. But Cacique talked about gymnastics and swimming, and about the GDR, too. In the Moscow 4x4, the East Germans were clearly the victims of the Soviet's bending the rules.

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  • Bruce Kritzler
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by Powell
    Originally posted by cacique
    weren't those 2 countries famous for using a gymnast (or swimmer) in qualifying, only to have her suddenly 'injured' before the final and replaced by a well rested superstar?
    :?: In gymnastics you can't change the team between qualifying and final in any circumstances. In swimming you can change the entire team without giving reaons. Methinks you are misremembering something.
    In the 1980 Moscow Olympics (before relay teams had free substitutions) USSR ran a "B" team in 4x4 prelims. They all claimed medical reasons for not running the final, and were miraculously replaced by the "A" team.

    Leave a comment:


  • Powell
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by cacique
    weren't those 2 countries famous for using a gymnast (or swimmer) in qualifying, only to have her suddenly 'injured' before the final and replaced by a well rested superstar?
    :?: In gymnastics you can't change the team between qualifying and final in any circumstances. In swimming you can change the entire team without giving reaons. Methinks you are misremembering something.

    Leave a comment:


  • cacique
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by Alexm
    Is there any possibility that Bettie Wade will be 'persuaded' to drop out, or 'picks up an injury', so that Fountain can take her place in the heptatlon for Berlin?
    what is this? the soviet union? GDR?

    weren't those 2 countries famous for using a gymnast (or swimmer) in qualifying, only to have her suddenly 'injured' before the final and replaced by a well rested superstar?

    Leave a comment:


  • tm71
    replied
    As we all know, nothing happened and Cannon went to Seoul, as he earned.

    and what did cannon do in seoul ? bombed !

    anyway besides the kidding, someone who barely made the B standard and most B standards are VERY WEAK, has no chance of doing anything in the worlds or olympics other than being back in the pack, way back in the pack.
    btw there have been a lot of instances when people gave up their spots example quincy watts in 1991 gave up his spot in the 400 meters (i think it went to valmon or everett) and just run the relay. i am sure there have been others...

    Leave a comment:


  • Pego
    replied
    Apples and oranges. There is a wide window of options to choose the relay. Do you know of a specific instance, when an athlete(s) who qualified in the trials got replaced by a non-finishing star? There was a huge amount of speculation last year, suggesting that Mary Wineberg might be "bought out" of her spot to Beijing in favor of Sanya. When Robert Cannon beat out a trio of superstars (Conley, Joyner, Harrison - well Harrison was not quite a superstar yet) in 1988, I heard all sorts of things in the stands as to "what should be done". As we all know, nothing happened and Cannon went to Seoul, as he earned.

    Leave a comment:


  • Alexm
    replied
    Off the top of my head there's the 92 relay controversy, where it seemed Rosen wanted to get Johnson into the 4x4 pool, the "Michael Johnson Rule" as Everett and Lewis allegedly called it. Of course, Lewis himself ended up in the 4x1 too because of Witherspoons injury, but initially it was the be the first 4 in the 100m at the trials and of course he didnt finish in th top 4, whereas with the 4x4 they chose the first 3 plus Johnson from the outset. So there was a definate different approach initially to the two teams. Admittedly the rules had changed the year before so they could choose anyone who comepeted at the trials, but the point is, if there is a way of getting a gold medal candidate in the team, then it can be and has been done by various countries, the USA included.

    I was just speculating that, as Fountain is in gold medal form, and the 3rd qualifier at the trials is a B qualifier, would there be any pressure on her to drop out and would USATF be able to select Fountain under their rules? I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but is there a way it could happen?

    Leave a comment:


  • Pego
    replied
    Originally posted by Alexm
    It's happened before.
    When?

    Leave a comment:


  • Alexm
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by Rineanna
    Well that's just silly. Wade earned her place fair and square. It's unfortunate that Fountain won't be there, but that's life, and Wade shouldn't be 'made' drop out.
    It's happened before. Just because Nelson has a qualifier it doesnt mean she'd automatically replace Wade tjough, would it?

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  • gm
    replied
    How exactly would Fountain, who did not finish the USA hept, replace Wade? Lela Nelson was 4th and has a B qualifier.

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  • Rineanna
    replied
    Re: Fountain vs Wade

    Originally posted by Alexm
    Is there any possibility that Bettie Wade will be 'persuaded' to drop out, or 'picks up an injury', so that Fountain can take her place in the heptatlon for Berlin?
    Well that's just silly.

    Wade earned her place fair and square. It's unfortunate that Fountain won't be there, but that's life, and Wade shouldn't be 'made' drop out.

    Leave a comment:


  • Alexm
    started a topic Fountain vs Wade

    Fountain vs Wade

    Is there any possibility that Bettie Wade will be 'persuaded' to drop out, or 'picks up an injury', so that Fountain can take her place in the heptatlon for Berlin?
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