Why Do Both USATF and AAU Call It "Junior Olympics"

[Halfmiler2]

I agree with Half-Miler. 1981 was the start of TAC. it was known as "The Athletic Conference." AAU still had 15-18 running against each other. TAC had the same. For TAC, the top 2 go to Nationals. AAU had the same.

Both Junior Olympic programs originally had only the high school age groups advancing to the national meets. The younger age groups stopped at the regional level. But the success of the short-lived but excellent International Youth Meet of Champions (IYMOC) in 1985 drawing kids from throughout the USA and Canada convinced both programs to let the younger athletes advance to the national mmets.

[Halfmiler2]

"1981 was the start of TAC. it was known as "The Athletic Conference."
--------
It has been my understanding that TAC was "The Athletics Congress." But the effect was the same: spoken of as "The TAC" so "the" article is repeated.

The Athletics Congress (TAC/USA) was the original correct name. It was changed at the end of 1992 to the current USATF name. There was originally some resistance in the LDR community to using T&F in the name, so the international term for our sport "Athletics" was used instead. But the public in the USA never understood TAC's name, so it was finally changed.

[James Fields]

"1981 was the start of TAC. it was known as "The Athletic Conference."
--------
It has been my understanding that TAC was "The Athletics Congress." But the effect was the same: spoken of as "The TAC" so "the" article is repeated.

[gh]

Am I the only one who thinks that this whole Jesse Owens thing on the U.S. uniforms was a misbegotten enterprise?

Every time I see a U.S. athlete on camera pointing to "JO" I wonder why he/she is celebrating the Junior Olympics. JO has meant nothing else for decades, and never meant Mr. Owens.

[Big Daddy]

I agree with Half-Miler. 1981 was the start of TAC. it was known as "The Athletic Conference." AAU still had 15-18 running against each other. TAC had the same. For TAC, the top 2 go to Nationals. AAU had the same.

[Halfmiler2]

Re: "Why Do Both USATF and AAU Call It "Junior Oly

All I know is the idiots who award championships to sites have chosen 4900' altitude Reno, NV for the Cross-Country race this year.

Had 2-3 kids interested, but no way am I going to encourage them to have their own personal Mexico City '68. These kids aren't good enough for Nike or any other big meet yet (young teen age groupers).

And yes, I know Reno is a nice town and has just as much right as any other city to bid on the meet, etc. That's not the point.

Actually, the J.O. championship site is still determined by a vote of the entire USATF Youth Committee. It is on a three-year rotation (West, Central, East), so Reno was up against other Western sites - usually several make bid presentations.

There are over a hundred potential voters on the committee, but I think there are usually between 40 and 80 votes cast when a J.O. site is decided at a USATF convention a couple years ahead of the meet. Most of the voters are youth coaches. Reno must have been decided at the 2007 convention. I am not on the Youth Committee and do not recall who else bid against Reno but would guess that there was one or two bids from Califormia and maybe Spokane. I am not sure about Oregon.

I'd expect rival bidders would have pointed out Reno's altitude but its other advantages must have convinced the voters to vote for it anyway. In any event, an altitude of 4900 feet for Reno doesn't sound quite right to me. I ran in a race there in the 1980's and recall it as being just over 3,000 feet.

[Halfmiler2]

Re: "Why Do Both USATF and AAU Call It "Junior Oly

AAU started "Junior Olympics" in late 1940s but in recent decades that title has been used by USATF for exclusively track and field competition while AAU conducts a multi-sport "Junior Olympic Games."

I have officiated track and field competition for both the AAU and USATF programs and should mention that both use the same (USATF) rulebook.

I'm now traveling, away from my bookshelf with USATF operating rules which I believe show AAU in a USATF member category.

Yep, AAU is now a USATF member but not in the highest -level membership category in which the MCAA, NFHS, and RRCA belong among others. The AAU is eligible to send one delegate to the USATF national convention compared to ten for the NCAA, and it can seat one representative on the USATF Youth committee compared to three for the NFHS. Also, it does not get to share a representative on the USATF Board which the others do.

[gm]

The JO XC nationals were in Albuquerque not too many years ago. No one seemed to have any problems. Always helps to call people idiots, though!

[Brian]

Re: "Why Do Both USATF and AAU Call It "Junior Oly

AAU started "Junior Olympics" in late 1940s but in recent decades that title has been used by USATF for exclusively track and field competition while AAU conducts a multi-sport "Junior Olympic Games."

I have officiated track and field competition for both the AAU and USATF programs and should mention that both use the same (USATF) rulebook.

I'm now traveling, away from my bookshelf with USATF operating rules which I believe show AAU in a USATF member category.

All I know is the idiots who award championships to sites have chosen 4900' altitude Reno, NV for the Cross-Country race this year.

Had 2-3 kids interested, but no way am I going to encourage them to have their own personal Mexico City '68. These kids aren't good enough for Nike or any other big meet yet (young teen age groupers).

And yes, I know Reno is a nice town and has just as much right as any other city to bid on the meet, etc. That's not the point.

[James Fields]

"Why Do Both USATF and AAU Call It "Junior Olympic

AAU started "Junior Olympics" in late 1940s but in recent decades that title has been used by USATF for exclusively track and field competition while AAU conducts a multi-sport "Junior Olympic Games."

I have officiated track and field competition for both the AAU and USATF programs and should mention that both use the same (USATF) rulebook.

I'm now traveling, away from my bookshelf with USATF operating rules which I believe show AAU in a USATF member category.

[Halfmiler2]

Actually, you can blame George Steinbrunner, of all people, for the dual Junior Olympic programs.

When TAC/USA (now USATF) took over as the National Governing Body (NGB) of our sport in 1980 from AAU, there was discussion about a single J.O. program with TAC running the local and regional meets advancing athletes to a multi-sport national championship overseen by AAU.

I came into TAC after the fact but was always told that the sticking point that blocked a unified program was that AAU had Sears as a J.O. sponsor providing leased cars to J.O. regional coordinators and they did not want to give that up. In any event, some locals in 1981 held J.O. meets that allowed kids to advance higher to either J.O program but that was quickly squelched. Meanwhile, AAU and TAC had an unresolved dispute about whether the former had transferred over to the latter all the assets it was supposed to with the transfer of NGB status. This made things a bit testy.

By the late 1980's, some other NGB's were also ticked off at the AAU and complained to the USOC that the AAU had no right to use the Junior Olympic title. The USOC named a committee headed by its Vice President George Steinbrenner to review the matter. The committee ruled that only NGB's could use the Junior Olympic term at the local and regional level but AAU could use the term for its national competition only - provided it was a multi-sport competition. This is why AAU cross country isn't called Junior Olympics anymore - it is a single sport event.

Since then, USATF and AAU have gotten on better terms and try to coordinate scheduling to avoid conflicts. As part of the USATF restructuring last year, USATF created a Youth Advisory Council which brings USATF, AAU, Hershey, NFHS, etc. all to the same table to discuss common matters and try to resolve problems.

As to a comparison of the two programs, USATF has the bigger national meet with better quality marks, but AAU has narrowed the gap a bit recently, in part by allowing younger age-groups to their national meet than USATF allows. At the regional and local levels, there is probably even a wider gap in the competitions - it tends to be easier to advance in the AAU program. And has has been pointed out in prior posts, some folks will always go to the alternative that is closer in order to reduce travel costs.

[gm]

Pat, I would gently disagree about the NGB not being concerned with costs for clubs. That is part of the rationale behind moving the championship meet around the country in a broad rotation. It is certainly something that comes up in many of the youth-centered discussions.

[ppalmer]

Thanks. I put together a Toledo-area e-mail newsletter not unlike eTN and I wanted to have a sidebar explaining "Why are there two Junior Olympics programs?" Apparently, it's the American political way: satisfying even semi-powerful interest groups always trumps the common good.

A useful result of the dual system is that we can send our kids to the one that is closest in a particular year. That is, in recent years, the state and regional USATF JO and AAU meets have been on different weekends. So, we have twice as many qualifying meets available. Then, we send kids to the nearest nationals, either AAU or USATF.

I realize that neither of the two organizations are worried much about costs for youth clubs. But, our concern is to minimize travel expenses for us and parents.

Pat Palmer

[Mighty Favog]

Thanks. I put together a Toledo-area e-mail newsletter not unlike eTN and I wanted to have a sidebar explaining "Why are there two Junior Olympics programs?" Apparently, it's the American political way: satisfying even semi-powerful interest groups always trumps the common good.

[Marlow]

Our sport is organized and run by so many alphabet soups that it will remain a complete cluster-f until the end of time.

They all serve their own purpose (beyond the obvious: making money for themselves) - down here in FLA (and I'm sure it's the same elsewhere) the USATF JO, the AAU JO, the Hershey Games, the Sunshine State Games (FLA's own multi-sport extravaganza), etc., all serve slight different groups and give the kids a chance to compete in the summer. The performance levels are often so low, almost EVERYONE can get a medal, so whatever keeps the little tykes in T&F (to whatever degree) is OK by me. I do, however, object to the travel-package purveyors who sell you travel, accommodations, food plans, etc., to 'qualified athletes and families' (translation: if you have the $$$, you're qualified) to go to some of these things. They are mostly just rip-off artists. :evil: