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  • #46
    Originally posted by Daisy
    You think more were there for Vlasic?
    wrong emoticon.........see edit post above.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Daisy
      Originally posted by Ned Ryerson
      who end up like Andreas Krieger?
      Just out of interest is she the sole case? If there was systematic use of steroids in the 70's and 80's wouldn't we have seen more examples of this? We have discussed this before but never resolved whether there is a real correlation with PED's.
      A 2004 New York Times articles claimed that "an estimated 500 to 2000 former East German athletes are believed to be experiencing significant health problems associated with steroids, including liver tumors, heart disease, testicular and breast cancer, gynecological problems, infertility, depression and eating disorders" and that "some female athletes have reported miscarriages and have had children born with deformities like club feet."

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      • #48
        Originally posted by guruof track
        And lets just be VERY frank, the HJ doesnt sell tickets.
        Huh? Wasn't she their best bet for a gold medal leading into the event? Womans HJ does not sell tickets? I'm not sure I agree with that.

        Originally posted by guruof track
        Friedrich didn't get the same reaction as Bolt.
        But she was asking the crowd to be quiet, wasn't she? And she had a bad competition, so it was a let down for the crowd. They thought she would win and that's what they wanted to sheer for. After her third failure they were very loud in appreciation, if I recall correctly.

        Originally posted by Ned Ryerson
        "an estimated 500 to 2000 former East German athletes are believed to be experiencing significant health problems associated with steroids, including liver tumors, heart disease, testicular and breast cancer, gynecological problems, infertility, depression and eating disorders" and that "some female athletes have reported miscarriages and have had children born with deformities like club feet."
        How many had sex changes?

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        • #49
          Womans HJ does not sell tickets? I'm not sure I agree with that.
          Without transgressing the 'hot women comments' rule, it is my considered opinion that HJ and PV ladies are the most beautiful in ALL of sportdom, and DO attract people to the sport, at least in its televised version.

          Comment


          • #50
            T&FN Forum participants have provided some well-written responses to the Pitch Johnson essay, "Hardcore fan's opinion: Track has a PR problem."

            Many respondents included PED but have not so far replied to this portion of the essay:
            . . . deliberate diminution of track by the NCAA in restricting scholarships and controlling the number of competitions, which has killed off most dual meets and the related student and community interest in school vs. school competition.

            It would be good to see that response void filled by some of the forum's knowledgeable contributors.

            (I remember my pleasurable introduction to the sport when fans followed the cumulating team score at dual meets, with scant attention to non-winning marks, and excitement of the mile relay determining which team won the meet -- a contest that rarely exceeded 2-1/2 hours.)

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            • #51
              [quote=guruof track]
              Originally posted by Daisy
              Originally posted by "guruof track":1jluddtx
              But do you think more people came to Bolt run or Vlasic jump? Honestly?
              Probably they were there to see Friedrich, right?
              Humour me. ops:

              I can tell you that looking at the meet, and having personal friends at the meet, Friedrich didn't get the same reaction as Bolt. I understand people were there and they were going to support her because of their patriotism (imagine that, probably a bunch of trolls ), but Germans had been competting the whole meet and only one day sold out. And lets just be VERY frank, the HJ doesnt sell tickets.[/quote:1jluddtx]

              I was in the stadium and that whole area of seats around the turn by the high jump pit was packed with energetic Germans. Foreigners were seated all across the stadium, but Germans surrounded that part of the stadium. I'm not arguing against Bolt's draw, but I am suggesting that a large portion of tickets, particularly in those otherwise undesirable and cheaper sections, were sold after ISTAF and before Bolt-mania hit Berlin.

              As for the Women's High Jump, I think it's a major event in Europe. For one, Europeans tend to dominate it. There was a massive poster of Friedrich dominating the exterior of the Nike store in Berlin. Her stock went up massively after ISTAF and I'm sure her celebrity played a major role in that night being sold out.

              The 22nd was also sold out, as well.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Daisy
                Originally posted by guruof track
                And lets just be VERY frank, the HJ doesnt sell tickets.
                Huh? Wasn't she their best bet for a gold medal leading into the event? Womans HJ does not sell tickets? I'm not sure I agree with that.
                Ok, Lets see her appearance fees and lets see SAF's. That will tell you all you need to know. Or maybe we should compare hers to Bolts since they did compete on the same day.

                Meet directors can't afford to put Gay/Bolt in the same meets barely, and definitely can't afford to put them in the same race. Vlasic and Friedrich compete at almost EVERY single meet. Simple economics tell me thats for a reason.

                They set up a street race for Bolt that had almost over 2 million viewers world wide (even MORE by some counts) and sponsors out the wazoo. How many viewer would a Vlasic/Friedrich single event jump off garner? Or sponsors.

                Lets be serious and have a real conversation. I understand Germans came out to support their country woman, but i'll say it again Bolt was the MAIN draw BAR NONE. If hardcore track fans can except that, then I see why our sport in a stagnant state. Until we address problems like these, instead of ingnore them with our head in the sand, track will always be a novelty in sports.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Marlow
                  Womans HJ does not sell tickets? I'm not sure I agree with that.
                  Without transgressing the 'hot women comments' rule, it is my considered opinion that HJ and PV ladies are the most beautiful in ALL of sportdom, and DO attract people to the sport, at least in its televised version.
                  Yes.. in the televised version I can see that. But you don't get the same view from a stadium seat.

                  Facts are facts and the sprints are the premiere crowd attractors at every major meet. Its LIKELY that many people were there to see Bolt break a world record and the fact that Friedrich was competing too was a huge bonus.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by guruof track
                    Bolt was the MAIN draw BAR NONE
                    Here we go again.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by mor'fiyah
                      Originally posted by Marlow
                      Womans HJ does not sell tickets? I'm not sure I agree with that.
                      Without transgressing the 'hot women comments' rule, it is my considered opinion that HJ and PV ladies are the most beautiful in ALL of sportdom, and DO attract people to the sport, at least in its televised version.
                      Yes.. in the televised version I can see that. But you don't get the same view from a stadium seat.

                      Facts are facts and the sprints are the premiere crowd attractors at every major meet. Its LIKELY that many people were there to see Bolt break a world record and the fact that Friedrich was competing too was a huge bonus.
                      Its not even just the sprints, because LOTS of people LOVE distance.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by mor'fiyah
                        Bolt break a world record and the fact that Friedrich was competing too was a huge bonus.
                        This was exactly what I suggested above. If you're only going to buy a couple of tickets you maximize your bang for your buck. When you're german you want an excuse to be able to wave your flag as well as see outstanding performances.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by guruof track
                          Ok, Lets see her appearance fees and lets see SAF's. That will tell you all you need to know.
                          OK, give us the figures.
                          Było smaszno, a jaszmije smukwijne...

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Daisy
                            Originally posted by mor'fiyah
                            Bolt break a world record and the fact that Friedrich was competing too was a huge bonus.
                            This was exactly what I suggested above. If you're only going to buy a couple of tickets you maximize your bang for your buck. When you're german you want an excuse to be able to wave your flag as well as see outstanding performances.
                            Right. Understood. But you seem to be assigning equal merit to Friedrich and to Bolt as opposed to Bolt maybe being the primary draw and Friedrich a healthy bonus that comes along with seeing a potential historical record.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              I guess what i am saying is... if there were no medal contending Germans in any of these events or if the high jump was moved to another day does anyone really think that the stadium still would not have sold out on the days Bolt runs in a final?

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by mor'fiyah
                                Right. Understood. But you seem to be assigning equal merit to Friedrich and to Bolt as opposed to Bolt maybe being the primary draw and Friedrich a healthy bonus that comes along with seeing a potential historical record.
                                Not really, I'm saying that she is part of the explaination for why the Germans would be out in force. Besides the only reason i brought up Friedrich was due to the following comment:
                                Originally posted by guruof track
                                But do you think more people came to Bolt run or Vlasic jump? Honestly?
                                Obviously THAT was the wrong question.

                                And that was in reply to:
                                Originally posted by Ned Ryerson
                                People seem to forget that the night of the first sellout in Berlin featured not only the Men's 200m final, but the final of the Women's High Jump, as well.
                                And note too that Ned did not imply that Bolt was not a big draw.

                                Why do people get so defensive? The whole point of this thread is what will get a crowd to a track meet. Not posturing over who is the biggest draw, who gets paid the most, that is all completely irrelevant to the thread.

                                Does anyone seriously deny that a home town favourite is NOT going to be "part" of the reason for one of the few sell out crowds? How could this ever be viewed as some challenge to Bolt's popularity?

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