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#1 USA 5K - Ritz or Teg?

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  • #1 USA 5K - Ritz or Teg?

    So who does T&FN rank #1 in the U.S. for 5k in 2009, Ritzenhein or Tegenkamp?
    Teg has the honors (USA champs and a top 10 WC finish) and a sub-13, plus his other pretty fast race. Ritz has the AR and some scalps in placing 3rd, but no real victories. And they didn't meet head-to-head, did they?
    The day after Ritz's race many were giving him a spot in the World top 10, but Teg actually has a pretty good case for U.S. #1 and maybe a World top 10 spot.
    Oh, did I forget to mention Lagat, #2 in the WC?
    Should be interesting!!!

  • #2
    Lagat.

    Is it even debatable?

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    • #3
      Very good question. Considering the way these things typically go, I'll bet the final verdict is: Lagat, Teg, Ritz--that is, medals over times.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by kuha
        Very good question. Considering the way these things typically go, I'll bet the final verdict is: Lagat, Teg, Ritz--that is, medals over times.
        Important races and medals should always take precedent over time imo especially in the longer races where you may be fortunate to get in a quick race. Lagat should be #1. Tegencamp #2 and Ritz #3

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        • #5
          I'm hopeful that next year, now that he is done with his collegiate career, that Galen Rupp will give these guys a run and also go under 13:00...

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          • #6
            How Lagat can be anything but #1 in the US escapes me. He was second in the most important race of the year.

            Ritz beat a number of guys who finished ahead of Teg at the WC. That's going to work against Teg. Ritz also beat a guy like Ebuya who beat Teg at Zurich and Brussels respectively. Not sure how many of those situations either way exist.

            My guess is that it's Lagat, Ritz and Teg with Lagat and Ritz top 10 and Teg just outside it.

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            • #7
              The criteria are clear.
              a) Honors Won, meaning placing high (with an emphasis on actually winning) in the biggest races.
              b) Head-to-head record
              c) Series of marks

              I'd guess 12:58 and 13:07 beats 12:56 alone, and the US title and Worlds final was probably enough for Teg to be ahead of Ritz anyway. Worlds silver for Lagat means he's more or less a lock for somewhere in the top 5, maybe as high as #2 (unlikely, but possible) and Teg doesn't belong that high.

              If somehow all three make the top ten it will be the 4th time the USA has done so. In '74 Buerkle, Pre and Steve Geis went 4-6-10; in '75 it was Liquori, Pre and Shorter going 3-9-10; and in '85 it was Padilla, Maree and Bickford going 2-3-10.

              I'd pay good money to see Lagat v. Teg v. Ritz v. Rupp at 5k. Pre Classic next summer?

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              • #8
                Paul Geis

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                • #9
                  So do you place Ritz or Rupp at 10k? imo, Rupp deserves #1 because of his NCAA and USATF titles even though he was behind Ritz at worlds. His dominating performance at National champs to me was key.

                  Hopefully we can also see G. Fernandez in the mix as well. It is a good time to be a distance fan in the USA!

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by pickle47
                    So who does T&FN rank #1 in the US for 5k in 2009...
                    Originally posted by Mighty Favog
                    Lagat v Teg v Ritz v Rupp
                    Originally posted by iaaf.org
                    After the conclusion of the last qualifying meeting before the World Athletics Final, the 7 Athletes having the highest number of points with their best 5 results will qualify for each event of the World Athletics Final. For the races of 1500m and over, 11 athletes will be qualified. The Athletes for the 8th and 12th position will be invited at the discretion of the IAAF.
                    Will any American meet the criteria/ invite for the Sept 13 WAF 5k in Thessaloniki?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by odelltrclan
                      So do you place Ritz or Rupp at 10k? imo, Rupp deserves #1 because of his NCAA and USATF titles even though he was behind Ritz at worlds. His dominating performance at National champs to me was key.

                      Hopefully we can also see G. Fernandez in the mix as well. It is a good time to be a distance fan in the USA!
                      Rupp all the way. I'm convinced he would have finished ahead of Ritz in Berlin, but for the fact that he had a much longer, more successful season (at least in the 10,000).

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                      • #12
                        "would have" ?

                        Rankings aren't about "would have". Ritz and Rupp were 1-1 in head to head comp, with Ritz finishing higher in the more important race. Ritz will be ranked ahead of Rupp.

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                        • #13
                          duplicate post

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                          • #14
                            5000 is clear: Lagat, Teg, Ritz (ahead of Solinsky, I think)

                            10,000 is less clear, but the USATF is a Trials race and the primary objective is to place on the team. Thus, WCs count a lot more and the time was a pretty good one as well. 1-1 head-to-head, the big stage counts most.

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                            • #15
                              Perhaps the most important question for the 10,000 rankings is who will get the higher world ranking (or any world ranking). US rankings always follow the order of world rankings, so if Ritz gets a world ranking and Rupp doesn't, he'll be ranked ahead of Rupp on the US rankings.

                              With very few 10,000s of any importance other than the World Champs this season (I hope to do a bit of research in the "off" season on the decline of 10,000s in Europe), it would seem as if Ritz should get a world ranking based on his 6th at Worlds. No idea if Rupp, who was 8th, will get a world ranking.

                              Without looking too closely, one athlete who didn't compete at Worlds but might deserve a ranking is Josphat Muchiri with his 2 sub-27:00s in Japan.

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