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Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

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  • Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

    Just curious what the chances might be of Nick Symmonds breaking the American record in the 1000 meters at Pre?

    2:13.9 Rick Wohlhuter (UCTC) Oslo, Norway 7/30/74

  • #2
    Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

    He's stated pretty clearly that he's motivated by winning, not times. There's a difference between whether he "can" or whether he "will" break the record, but I'll bet he does not.

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    • #3
      Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

      While 2:13.9 'only' represents a 1:47.1 pace, put me in the skeptical camp too. He's a racer, not a runner. Now, if the pace is red-hot (assuming bunnies), perhaps there's a $$$ incentive to factor in. That's tilts the balance a bit.

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      • #4
        Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

        The average speed differential between two distances can be seen a different way. Look at the 'marginal' pace. That is, going from 1:43.9 to 2:13.9 requires a time of 30 seconds/200m = 60/400m. This is about what we see from other distances (e.g., 3:42+ 1600+, 4:43 2000m is just over 60 for 400m. Taking the WR for 1500m, adding 8% gets a 3:42.48 mile, which is a marginal pace of 60.2 for 400m. Note that converting a 4-minute mile (a 3:42.22 1500m) has a marginal pace of 64+, so it only works out to 60 for WR(men) pace. Going from the 800m WR to the 1500m WR has a marginal pace of 60 seconds also. Thus, Symmond's incremental pace is about right to break the AR from a quality point of view but it is not clear if he is as good at 1000m vs 800 (i.e., what is his optimal distance).

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        • #5
          Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

          Cant wait to see this race. Kaki is in 1:42 flat shape and Nick is in, maybe without heats 1:44..mmmm it will be interesting! I would imagine Kaki goes with the rabbit and Nick holds back, makes a late charge that comes up short.
          phsstt!

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          • #6
            Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

            Could Kaki possibly go after the World Record?

            1000 2:11.96 Noah Ngeny (Kenya) Rieti, Italy 9/05/99

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            • #7
              Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

              Originally posted by trackcoach
              Could Kaki possibly go after the World Record?

              1000 2:11.96 Noah Ngeny (Kenya) Rieti, Italy 9/05/99
              I doubt it. He ran 2:16.1 indoors and 2:13.93 outdoors in 2008. I think a mid 2:12 would be an amazing result.
              phsstt!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                The answer to both of these runners breaking the AR and WR respectively is very much leaning in a no direction.

                The next American with a somewhat legit shot at the 1000m record is Wheating but he's not at the level he needs to be at either the 800m to 1500m just yet.

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                • #9
                  Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                  Because Wheating appears to be a 800/1500 type, he should have a slight advantage on a pure 800 type. What about the up-and-coming guys like Andrews (who also has some 1500 range)?

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                  • #10
                    Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                    Originally posted by 26mi235
                    Because Wheating appears to be a 800/1500 type, he should have a slight advantage on a pure 800 type. What about the up-and-coming guys like Andrews (who also has some 1500 range)?
                    I think we need to see more of him over the longer distance but he does have the indoor HS record I believe.

                    I forgot about Alan Webb....if he gets healthy he can do it for sure.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                      Don't think Kaki is capable of breaking the 1000m WR, unless he's been keeping it secret that he's capable of a 3:30 1500m!
                      If the pace is efficient to 800 and he goes through in 1:45, he should get to low 2:13, possibly high 2:12.
                      As much as I like Symmonds, I don't think he'll break 2:15.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                        Originally posted by Dutra
                        I forgot about Alan Webb....
                        Don't folks get banished around here for doing that??

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                          Originally posted by trackcoach
                          Just curious what the chances might be of Nick Symmonds breaking the American record in the 1000 meters at Pre?

                          2:13.9 Rick Wohlhuter (UCTC) Oslo, Norway 7/30/74
                          I don't think Nick is going to beat it. It might seem like a relatively "soft record" but several 144ish runners have taken shots at it over the years and come up short. Since I believe Wohlhuter's AR is still number 8 world all-time, I would say it is a long shot.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                            Originally posted by Gebrucilassie
                            It might seem like a relatively "soft record" but several 144ish runners have taken shots at it over the years and come up short.
                            Yes--it is absolutely not a "soft" record...and Wohlhuter would have kicked the collective butt of pretty much all of today's (US) 800 guys.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Can Symmonds Break the American 1000 Meter Record at Pre?

                              Looking at the top-10 world and U.S. lists, what stands out to me is, with few exceptions, the guys that run the best 1000s are also very good at 1500/mile.

                              All time top-10 courtesy T&FN:
                              1000 METERS
                              2:11.96 Noah Ngeny (Kenya) 09/05/99
                              2:12.18 Sebastian Coe (Great Britain) 07/11/81
                              2:12.66 Ngeny 07/17/99
                              2:12.88 Steve Cram (Great Britain) 08/09/85
                              2:13.40 Coe 07/01/80
                              2:13.56 Kenneth Kimwetich (Kenya) 07/17/99
                              2:13.73 Noureddine Morceli (Algeria) 07/02/93
                              2:13.93 Abubaker Kaki (Sudan) 07/22/08
                              2:13.96 Mehdi Baala (France) 06/26/03
                              2:13.9 Rick Wohlhuter (US) 07/30/74
                              …………………………………………………………………………………..
                              2:14.09 Joaquim Cruz (Brazil) 08/20/84
                              2:14.28 Japheth Kimutai (Kenya) 08/01/00

                              All-time U.S.Top-10
                              1000 METERS
                              2:13.9 Rick Wohlhuter (University of Chicago TC) 07/30/74
                              2:15.97 David Krummenacker (adidas) 05/18/02
                              2:16.18 Bernard Lagat (Nike) 08/31/08
                              2:16.1 Tom Byers (Athletics West) 08/06/81
                              2:16.25 Lagat 08/07/07
                              2:16.3 James Robinson (Inter City AC) 08/09/81
                              2:16.40 Steve Scott (Sub 4) 08/23/81
                              2:16.45 Scott 07/03/83
                              2:16.54 Jim Spivey (Athletics West) 07/21/84
                              2:16.63 Krummenacker 07/30/99
                              …………………………………………………………………………………..
                              2:16.68 Steve Holman (Nike) 09/05/99
                              2:16.7 John Marshall (Villanova) 07/13/85
                              2:16.90 David Mack (Santa Monica TC) 07/23/85

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