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Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

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  • #31
    Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

    Thanks, Suso2
    This was terrific. Nice to have it confirmed about the straight body and slower rotation.
    It seems to me that Ukhov gets quite high with his head and shoulders going in over the bar compared to many other top jumpers. Now I see a reason for that.

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    • #32
      Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

      That was a very nice analysis. I think I would pick option four in this situation. As you mention, the angles of the video, etc. might have given the illusion of a higher jump than actually happened. However, the way the bar pops straight up lends towards someone coming straight down on the bar.

      I wonder what might have happened if he was an inch or so closer in at the plant. He tends to convert well to the vertical plane so I don't think his elevating torso would have clipped it. As we know, when you are attempting high heights like this your margin of error at the plant is infinitesimal. It can be as close as an inch at heights of 8' (2.44m).
      If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

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      • #33
        Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

        Originally posted by Suso2
        (1) un-arched too early
        (2) did not have enough backward somersaulting angular momentum
        (3) the straight body configuration that he adopted on the way up to the bar slowed his backward somersault rotation enough to make him hit the bar regardless of the timing of his un-arching.
        (4) he took off too far from the bar
        (5) maybe the final direction of his approach run was too parallel to the bar.
        (6) Ukhov's c.m. did not reach such a high peak height as is suggested by the maximum height reached by his lumbar region.
        My initial analysis above addressed the (7th) possibility that he simply took off with too high a trajectory angle (reducing horizontal travel over the bar) and hit it because his peak height was achieved too narrowly to avoid hitting the bar. I have that problem with athletes often when their run is too slow. They are able to achieve higher take-off angles, but too narrow a space to make the bar consistently. Ukhov is so strong he can probably jump too 'straight up' for his own good.

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        • #34
          Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

          He did not appear to take off anywhere near the tape marks on the run up so may have been too far away as well. Of course, the tape might have been laid down by the guy that PB'd at 1.95....

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          • #35
            Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

            About high early season indoor marks: Is it possbile that the timing and conditions facilitate these results? Athletes are coming off long periods of conditioning and strength training so they are fit and probably relatively injury-free, emotionally they are eager to jump and feeling less stress than they might at major outdoor meets and pumped by crowds very close by the event. Also, in wind-free, sun-free, temperature and humidity controlled conditions we might expect better results.

            About close misses: Suso and others always provide great technical insight. All the analysis tends to reinforce the basic fact that a miss is a miss is a miss and the cause of the miss is most often based on what happens before the jumper leaves the ground.

            We all know from jumping and coaching experience that what can seem so close to a spectator may have been a jump that never really had a chance. Waaaaay back in straddle days people would say "You were over but you just hit the bar with your trail leg!" and I'd think, "Yeah, that's how jumpers miss when their speed or take-off point or trajectory or just plain lack of elevation is wrong." In modern times the lament is that you just dropped your butt or grazed it with your calves as if the jumper merely forgot to do some body movement in the air. Don't we all wish it were so simple!?! But as many have pointed out here, the margin of error in an 8 foot jump is so fine that it almost defies precise definition.

            At any rate, Ukhov's mark was impressive, the miss at 2.44 was exciting, he is a great jumper and a world class character. Let's hope he stays on a productive course this year and beyond.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

              Originally posted by jhc68
              the cause of the miss is most often based on what happens before the jumper leaves the ground.
              I wouldn't say 'most often', at least with HS jumpers. Typically it's what happens in the air that causes their misses. They know how to 'jump', but they don't know what to do with their CoG's height. The arch is paramount, and most HSers have not mastered that sufficiently to optimize the height they're getting.

              LJ clinicians keep telling me the same thing: distance is determined at the moment of takeoff. If that were true, my athletes would be jumping a foot farther than they are now. Dropping one's feet early (because of poor in-flight mechanics) is my #1 nemesis. Just as ill-executed bar-clearance form is killing me in the HJ.

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

                Originally posted by Marlow
                [LJ clinicians keep telling me the same thing: distance is determined at the moment of takeoff. .
                I think the phrase should be, " the potential distance is determined at the moment of takeoff." Extension and control in flight are definitely factors but optimum angle and elevation is determined at takeoff.

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                • #38
                  Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

                  Originally posted by lonewolf
                  Originally posted by Marlow
                  [LJ clinicians keep telling me the same thing: distance is determined at the moment of takeoff. .
                  I think the phrase should be, " the potential distance is determined at the moment of takeoff." Extension and control in flight are definitely factors but optimum angle and elevation is determined at takeoff.
                  So wouldn't doing a cannonball, butt first into the sand, be the best technique? Seems to maximize the CoG travel!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

                    I totally agree with jhc68. I know Dwight Stones and others have stated that 90% of your jump is on the runway. If you handle the centrifigul forces well, nail the plant, and convert well to the vertical your technique does not necessarily have to be impeccable. Anybody remember Donald Thomas? However, if you screw yourself on the ground you can have Partyka or Sjoberg layout potential and still have no chance at a clearance.
                    If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

                      Originally posted by Dietmar239
                      I totally agree with jhc68. I know Dwight Stones and others have stated that 90% of your jump is on the runway. If you handle the centrifigul forces well, nail the plant, and convert well to the vertical your technique does not necessarily have to be impeccable. Anybody remember Donald Thomas? However, if you screw yourself on the ground you can have Partyka or Sjoberg layout potential and still have no chance at a clearance.
                      That's all true! But Ukhov was attempting 2.44 and THEN your clearance needs to be quite impeccable, No?

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Ukhov jumps 2.38m, gets very close to would-be WR 2.44m

                        True, however Marlow implied that this is generally the case. I believe the bar is a little more forgiving at lower heights. At WR heights, everything must come together. Motivation though is probably the biggest factor. I remember after Sjoberg's 2.42 in Stockholm, he stated that the locals had previously been giving him a hard time because his big jumps had been in central Europe, but never in Sweden. So in the span of just a few days he jumped a 2.39 in Goteburg and then the WR in Stockhom. So....maybe if we can get more of our jumpers passionate regarding their discipline we will see an upturn. One can only hope.
                        If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

                        Comment

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