What's wrong the US and the mile?

[RMc]

Re: What's wrong the US and the mile?

> Let's
>see a European male get off an EPO bust on a "technicality".

Let's see a European male actually get busted for using EPO! I'm not aware of a single positive test for a European-born male. The only 2 positives I'm aware of were both for naturalized French-North Africans. I think that says more about the (lack of) testing in Europe, especially given the obvious rampant use in cycling (e.g., note the extraordinary number of deaths the last year among competitive cyclists.)

[eldrick]

Re: What's wrong the US and the mile?

>> Let's
>see a European male get off an EPO bust on a
>"technicality".

Let's see a European male actually get busted for using
>EPO! I'm not aware of a single positive test for a European-born male. The
>only 2 positives I'm aware of were both for naturalized French-North Africans.
>I think that says more about the (lack of) testing in Europe, especially given
>the obvious rampant use in cycling (e.g., note the extraordinary number of
>deaths the last year among competitive cyclists.)



it's the testing - athletics uses urine tests for EPO, which are notoriously poor, whereas cycling uses blood tests, which give very good pick-up rates

once blood-testing for athletics is instituted, there could potentially be an explosion of +ve EPO tests in middle-distance runners

[The Fern]

Re: What's wrong the US and the mile?

Two words that have been hinted on here that are killing the mile in a lot of countries..WORK ETHIC! I have been coaching since the late 70's in the US and now in NZ where they are up in arms about their lack of middle distance runners. How many kids today could do the workouts of Ryun , Liquori, Snell and Walker? "Not Many, if Any" to quote a current rapper. NZ has some very talented prospects running in the US Collegiate system right now, we'll see how they go. But the comment was made that other persuits are pulling talent away from us. It's like I always say, "You can play football, basketball and baseball... but you can't play Track and Field, or Gymnastics or swimming for that matter." Work Ethic web friends, work ethic. It scares the faint of heart away.

[Retouch Man]

Re: What's wrong the US and the mile?

>EPO! I'm not aware of a single positive test for a European-born male. The
>only 2 positives I'm aware of were both for naturalized French-North Africans.
>I think that says more about the (lack of) testing in Europe, especially given
>the obvious rampant use in cycling (e.g., note the extraordinary number of
>deaths the last year among competitive cyclists.)

No. Saying one wouldn't see a European male get off on a "technicality" doesn't mean there is faulty testing. It possibly says a lot about selective enforcement, and a few other things, however. Many European performers are worried about spot testing. Not so for many if not most third world performers whose federations and Governments are all too willing to have athletes do whatever it takes to bring home some medals. That the "naturalized" French runners, Chouki among them, were booted while there was a furor over Lagat being popped, and then his "exoneration" on first what was listed as a negative "b" sample and then what the IAAF called a technicality reeks of crookedness. The skewing of performances since the arrival of Rosa (from cycling) and others on the scene in E. Africa is something else no one wants to look at. Other than to get into genetic-speak which doesn't account for the numbers, or lack of numbers in other populations. It's interesting how few top performers from these places will actually allow physiologists to test them these days.

If Chouki had been Kenyan like Lagat, he probably would have gotten off, and that's if the positive test had been announced in the first place. WADA says the EPO test does not give false positives, so what gives?

Track is not that big in the US in the first place, that's true. Not as big in Europe as it used to be, soccer is kicking its tail. But the suspicions, the feeling that the IAAF is letting some countries get away with doping and coming down on others is also giving a lot of Europeans (and maybe some Yanks) a "why bother?" attitude. Some may think there is nothing going on, but look at the US Federation and what has come out about its behavior with sprinters (TV's favorite and all), hiding test results and who knows what else over the years.

Yes, it's cultural too.