¶2011 WC: mSP—more PRs for Storl

[SantaCruz]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

I'm very happy for Storl. I've been following his career closely for a few years now.

Before Daegu, Storl was #13 on the German all-time list. Now he's #3 - only behind Ulf Timmermann and Udo Beyer. By the way: Timmermann threw 21.75 m at age 21. His lifetime PR is 23.06 m.

[Powell]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

Majewski was terrible today. He obviously hoped for the big one in round 1, and when that did not work, it was as if he fell apart. It looked like he was not even trying in rounds 2 and 3. He should normally be capable of throwing 20.50 with his eyes closed, and that would have been enough to guarantee him 3 more attempts.
Things have really been going badly for Poland since Wojciechowski's gold. Malachowski and Rogowska could be somewhat excused by their injuries, but this one really made me go WTF

[mcgato]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

Both Nelson and Hoffa have thrown far the early part of the season and have struggled to perform in the last three major finals (08, 09 and 11).

Since I did the research for a thread on letsrun, I'll reproduce it here. After all, few over there care about the field events.
-------------------------------
It seems to have been going on for the past decade or more. The US shows up to the WC or Olympics with 3 of the top 5 in the world, and then only get one medal or no medals. It doesn't happen every time, but more times than not.

2000: Year list has US with 21 of the top 25 marks, but only a silver in the Olympics.
2001: Gold and silver, so not true this year.
2003: Year list has US with 3 of the top 6 performers, but only a silver at the WC.
2004: Year list has US with 17 of the top 18 marks, but only a silver at the Olympics.
2005: Gold, but the three US entrants had the top 11 marks of the year and Godina didn't even make the final.
2007: Gold and silver, so not true this year.
2008: Year list has US with 3 of the top 4 performers, but only silver at the Olympics.
2009: Gold, plus a 4th and 5th. Probably to form, as the three US entrants were among the top 6 performers on the yearly list.
2011: Coming into the meet, the 4 US entrants were 3 through 6 on the yearly list, and they end up with no medals.

It's almost like the big three or four US shot putters compete against each other too often. They get super hyped for each competition and produce great marks, which makes them favorites for the global title. Perhaps even a sweep. Then the global competition heats up, and they somewhat underperform.

[NormZylstra]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

Caught Storl's slight smile before his final attempt... I was surprised to see such a young athlete exude such confidence on that stage. Very impressive.
See a screen grab here David Storl smiles

[tm71]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

It's almost like the big three or four US shot putters compete against each other too often. They get super hyped for each competition and produce great marks, which makes them favorites for the global title. Perhaps even a sweep. Then the global competition heats up, and they somewhat underperform.

VERY TRUE. this year a sweep would have been entirely unrealistic, but at least one medal and a few better performances. hoffa was stuck at just under 21 m and nelson was stuck below 67 feet. i wonder if the conditions in eugene are to blame for the disparity in performance in this event too ! i am kidding of course, but i think there should be some reasons why nelson and hoffa consistenly throw 70-72 feet at the usaf meet, but can not even come close to that in the worlds/olympics (with 05 and 07 being the notable exceptions).

[balzonia]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

It's almost like the big three or four US shot putters compete against each other too often. They get super hyped for each competition and produce great marks, which makes them favorites for the global title. Perhaps even a sweep. Then the global competition heats up, and they somewhat underperform.

VERY TRUE. this year a sweep would have been entirely unrealistic, but at least one medal and a few better performances. hoffa was stuck at just under 21 m and nelson was stuck below 67 feet. i wonder if the conditions in eugene are to blame for the disparity in performance in this event too ! i am kidding of course, but i think there should be some reasons why nelson and hoffa consistenly throw 70-72 feet at the usaf meet, but can not even come close to that in the worlds/olympics (with 05 and 07 being the notable exceptions).

7 of the top 16 shot putters in the world are from USA. There is such an emphasis on just making the team in June that future performances will suffer. The top putters in the US must peak at the end of June every year or they won't get to participate in the major event. Throwing 21.50m-22m, on demand, is not something any shot putter can expect to achieve. One has to be in peak form. It is difficult, and takes quite a bit of good fortune, to hit that peak twice, especially so far apart on the competition calendar.

Another, unrelated thought - It appears obvious that Storl and Bartels have a great relationship and were almost a two man team. Bartels was very happy for his countryman's success. When Storl had just won, he (Storl) walked towards the stands and lifted his jersey and pointed to the "Deutchland" on his chest. He showed a genuine, nationalistic pride as if his victory was as much for Germany as for himself. I don't know that I have seen this kind of camaraderie and nationalistic pride in USA shot putters. They compete against each other so often, at such high stakes, any sense of "team" is impossible to achieve in a major championship for them.

In an interview in Sweden earlier this year, Cantwell called the rest of the US shot putters "assholes" and insinuated they were no match for him. After watching this contest, it occurred to me that the USA men could possibly learn something from the Germans about throwing for a common goal and competing for something larger than the self. Instead of "me against the world" perhaps they should think "US against the world."

Or, I could be reading far too much into it and spinners just routinely choke at majors :wink:

[NormZylstra]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

David Storl glide
Dylan Armstrong rotation
Andrei Mikhnevich glide
Christian Cantwell rotation
Reese Hoffa rotation
Marco Fortes rotation
Ryan Whiting rotation
Adam Nelson rotation
Tomasz Majewski glide
Ralf Bartels glide
Asmir Kolašinac rotation
Carlos Véliz glide

[mojo]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

Caught Storl's slight smile before his final attempt... I was surprised to see such a young athlete exude such confidence on that stage. Very impressive.
See a screen grab here David Storl smiles

Not only did he smile he pumped his fist a bit-I knew it was going to big just didn't know if he could keep it from being a foul.

The shot has to be in the proximity of the neck-I don't think Miknevich's throws were fouls at all.

I am thrilled for Dylan Per. I admit intially I felt sad (gutted was too strong a word!)that he did not get gold. Not in a disappointed in Dylan way (never!) just a darn it so close kind way.

I was not making excuses and Dylan never would. Just an observation-albeit made from viewing a computer screen at 3am. They all had the same circle.

[Per Andersen]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

David Storl glide
Dylan Armstrong rotation
Andrei Mikhnevich glide
Christian Cantwell rotation
Reese Hoffa rotation
Marco Fortes rotation
Ryan Whiting rotation
Adam Nelson rotation
Tomasz Majewski glide
Ralf Bartels glide
Asmir Kolašinac rotation
Carlos Véliz glide

Thank you! I have to admit I like the glide but I understand completely that the spin has greatly added to the dynamism and the popularity of the event.

Compare the SP to the Discus where nothing basically new has happened technique wise for over 50 years. ( I don't count Silvester's wide swing leg).

[Marlow]

Re: ¶2011 WC: mSP—more PRs for Storl

In my inexpert opinion, the spinners don't use the upward-thrust potential of their legs as much as they should. If you watch the Big O from the 70s, he squatted down more in the spin and jumped up at release for much greater impetus. The gliders use their legs a lot. The spinners, not so much.

[bruce3404]

Re: 2011 WC: mSP—

7 of the top 16 shot putters in the world are from USA. There is such an emphasis on just making the team in June that future performances will suffer.

But that doesn't explain the many other events where the competition is fierce during the Trials, but athletes go on to excellent performances. While we may have 7/16, I don't think there was any question that the right four made the team and the drop off from #4 to #5 is steep. I don't know much about SP training, but it is puzzling why this curse seems to affect our SPers in most major championships.

[leoesharkey]

Re: ¶2011 WC: mSP—more PRs for Storl

It's simple really, the glide is a far more reliable technique, and it rarely buckles under pressure, just like the fixed foot discus throws, it relies on getting into a power position and then hitting it, and because the athletes know the technique is simpler and more reliable they worry less about it and are more relaxed.

The Spin dominates in the US and almost everywhere else, and it genuinely suits some guys.
The glide is not used in the US anymore and even globally the spin is beginning to ominate, BUT the glide makes the medals or wins in almost every major competition despite haveing far fewer practicioners at intl level.

Storl won world youths, world juniors, euro juniors, european cup (beating majewski olympic champuion) euro u23s and is world record holder with the 16lb shot as a junior, with 6kg shot as a junior, and with 16lb as an U-23, he is used to winning!

[NormZylstra]

Re: ¶2011 WC: mSP—more PRs for Storl

I understand there is a thread dedicated to Adam Nelson's post in The Ring but I wanted to archive it in this thread in case the two are not merged.

my thoughts.
[09:32 GMT, 09/08/2011] Sent by: nellie

If you like throwing and pissing matches read through the posts from the last couple weeks.

[NormZylstra]

Re: ¶2011 WC: mSP—more PRs for Storl

More from Adam Nelson in today's postings on The RING.