Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

[CoachK3311]

With Jeremy Wariner finishing in 6th place, do you think they will still take him to the Olympics to run in the 4x400 ?

[guru]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

As I mentioned on the Trials 400 thread, Drummond has shown time and again a soft spot for the veterans, perhaps most notably at last year's Worlds when he went with an injured Angelo Taylor(who was on crutches between races) in the 4x4 final over the red-hot Mike Berry. Only Merritt saved them from disaster. I fully expect he'll have Wariner in the pool, and more than likely on the finals lineup.

[ATK]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

Wariner has proved that he is not ready to be on any part of this team. He has gotten slower as the season has gone by, and while Mance, Nellums and MaQuay have proven their ability after rounds numerous times this season, Wariner has not.
But guru is right and Drummond might just see history.

As much as I respect Wariner and hold him as a legend in the event, a small part of me would actually want the US team to loose the relay if Wariner is on it. I just think it would be terrible for him to take the spot of an up a rising athlete who is better than him.

[jazzcyclist]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

He's earned the right to run the heat.

[gh]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

"earned"? Let me play devil's advocate (since I'm a sucker for the old-guy scenario)

Since they could run Reese Hoffa on the first leg and still Q for the final (minor hyperbole alert), it doesn't matter who the two prelim guys are.

So if Wariner already has a shitload of medals, didn't perhaps some "youngster" earn what might be his only chance by finishing ahead of him?

[kuha]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

Hmmm...can we get Adam Nelson on that team?

[berkeley]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

"earned"? Let me play devil's advocate (since I'm a sucker for the old-guy scenario)

Since they could run Reese Hoffa on the first leg and still Q for the final (minor hyperbole alert), it doesn't matter who the two prelim guys are.

So if Wariner already has a shitload of medals, didn't perhaps some "youngster" earn what might be his only chance by finishing ahead of him?

They could run Reese Hoffa on the 3rd or 4th leg, but definitely not the first. Hoffa would require at least 3 lanes, and he could only have one before the break for the pole at 500m. I guess he could possibly run the 2nd if they put Merritt on the first, Reese might be able to get through 100m before the others caught up to him. However, then the rest of the field would have to swing out into lane 4 to pass him.

[Chris Kuykendall]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

Wariner has proved that he is not ready to be on any part of this team. He has gotten slower as the season has gone by, and while Mance, Nellums and MaQuay have proven their ability after rounds numerous times this season, Wariner has not.
But guru is right and Drummond might just see history.

As much as I respect Wariner and hold him as a legend in the event, a small part of me would actually want the US team to loose the relay if Wariner is on it. I just think it would be terrible for him to take the spot of an up a rising athlete who is better than him.

This trashing of Wariner both on this thread and the Trials 400 thread baffles me. My understanding is that, in London, they can run four guys in the final and can take two alternates possibly to run prelim. By my arithmetic, that comes to six. Wariner finished sixth in the Trials 400. He's the sixth fastest guy in the United States in that event. Why would you want to take somebody slower instead? This "rising athlete who is better than him" is, demonstrably by the Trials results, a fictitious person, other than the five guys who finished first through fifth who I have no problem with filling the other five slots. The Trials are clutch time. Wariner finished faster than Verburg in two of three rounds. Roberts ran 45.64 in the prelims and 45.68, twelfth overall, in the semis. Hughes was 45.64 and 45.63, and coming into the Trials he had a season best 45.41 for 10th at the NCAAs. Lawrence ran 45.82 and 45.40 at Eugene, behind Wariner in his semi, and didn't make the NCAA final. Berry with a 44.75 at Des Moines is a possibility, but we kind of need to know why the 46.29 at the Trials which are where, not the NCAAs, people get their big chance to go to the Olympics and need to perform. So I'm kind of curious who this better guy is, because we know Wariner has plenty of relay experience. Wariner may not end up going to London, but the trashing is way off.

[guru]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

This trashing of Wariner both on this thread and the Trials 400 thread baffles me. My understanding is that, in London, they can run four guys in the final and can take two alternates possibly to run prelim. By my arithmetic, that comes to six. Wariner finished sixth in the Trials 400.

Taylor will have one of those pool slots(assuming he's top 4 in 400H)

[Chris Kuykendall]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

Taylor will have one of those pool slots(assuming he's top 4 in 400H)

The USOC says: "Selection to the relay pool does not automatically guarantee that an athlete will compete in the relay. Any Olympic Team member may be added to the relay." So you've got six in the pool, but somebody else from the Olympic team can still run the relay instead. If Taylor is top three and on the team already, my reading is they don't need to use up one of the six slots, putting him in one of those slots, in order for him to be relay-eligible. He's already eligible, as I read it. If that's wrong, then somebody tell me so.

I'm also not understanding, anyway, from where the certitude arises that Taylor "will have" one of the six slots if he finishes 4th in the 400 hurdles. The USOC: "The decision to place the two (2) discretionary athletes, per gender and per event, in the relay pool will be based on the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team relay coach’s judgment of that athlete’s ability to contribute to the success of the relay team." The USOC then lists five judgmental considerations. So unless guru is that coach or has a crystal ball, I fail to see how the certitude is warranted.

[guru]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

So unless guru is that coach or has a crystal ball, I fail to see how the certitude is warranted.

Considering Drummond's loyalty to Taylor at Worlds last year, and the fact he broke 45 in early May, I'd be willing to bet my house Taylor will be in Drummond's London gameplan(and probably deservedly so after his Doha run)

[SQUACKEE]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

Reese Hoffa is a wonderful choice to lead off, except I think the 2nd runner might be throw off when Reese hands him a turkey leg rather then the stick.

[ATK]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

This trashing of Wariner both on this thread and the Trials 400 thread baffles me. My understanding is that, in London, they can run four guys in the final and can take two alternates possibly to run prelim. By my arithmetic, that comes to six. Wariner finished sixth in the Trials 400. He's the sixth fastest guy in the United States in that event. Why would you want to take somebody slower instead? This "rising athlete who is better than him" is, demonstrably by the Trials results, a fictitious person, other than the five guys who finished first through fifth who I have no problem with filling the other five slots.

I'm not trashing Wariner, I'm stating facts. I respect his legend status but see it as unfair to run him over a younger athlete who is currently better than him.
The only athletes who will potentially be in the relay pool who are older than Wariner are Taylor, Jackson, and Tinsley who is the same age. But they are currently the top 3 Hurdlers in the US and have proven their fitness their(and Taylor is sub 45 in the flat this year and has beaten Wariner.)
Just because he was 6th does not mean they just go down the line of 400m finishers.
They don't have to run 2 alternates in the prelims. They will run who they think is the best team to qualify to the finals and the best team to win a gold medal.
Also notice that last year Miles Smith who finished in 6th at USA's in the 400m was not included in the relay pool.

[john6370]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

No JW should not run. Even if he gets picked he should turn it down. I do have alot of respect for him but i will have A lot more if he gets picked and turns it down. Let the guys that beat him run because it is a once in a lifetime for most runners and JW has already won a lot and did not earn the right to run this year.

[kamikaze7]

Re: Will Jeremy Wariner be on the 4x4?

This has shades of Carl Lewis vs Jon Drummond circa 1996