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¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

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  • mump boy
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by tgs3
    Originally posted by mump boy
    While i too think that the time is irrelevant to the winner, i just don't understand those who have no chance of winning not wanting to make some kind of effort. Do they all honestly think they can outsprint Mo or Bernie in a slow race ??
    Isn't that exactly what Gebremeskel and Longosiwa did? Outsprint Lagat in a slow race?
    i'm not talking about those 2 who would obviously have a chance at any pace, i'm mean those who are going to come 10-15th , why not give it a go and see if you can lose a few so you may get 8th

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  • TN1965
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by tgs3
    Originally posted by mump boy
    While i too think that the time is irrelevant to the winner, i just don't understand those who have no chance of winning not wanting to make some kind of effort. Do they all honestly think they can outsprint Mo or Bernie in a slow race ??
    Isn't that exactly what Gebremeskel and Longosiwa did? Outsprint Lagat in a slow race?
    They were helped by Iguider, who could not help his own cause since he was passed by Lagat anyway.

    Leave a comment:


  • TN1965
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by mump boy
    While i too think that the time is irrelevant to the winner, i just don't understand those who have no chance of winning not wanting to make some kind of effort. Do they all honestly think they can outsprint Mo or Bernie in a slow race ??

    I would have much more respect for those who decide to go down in a blaze of glory than those who are happy to jog around at the back and end up where they expected in the firs place. What's the point of being there unless you play to your strengths ?? :?
    I cannot agree more. When there are 15 runners in the final, not all of them cannot possibly be the three best kickers.

    Maybe Gebremeskel and Longosiwa (or another Kenyan) would have ended up with silver and bronze anyway, but they might have had better chances to beat Mo if they and their teammates had employed different tactics.

    Leave a comment:


  • tgs3
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by mump boy
    While i too think that the time is irrelevant to the winner, i just don't understand those who have no chance of winning not wanting to make some kind of effort. Do they all honestly think they can outsprint Mo or Bernie in a slow race ??
    Isn't that exactly what Gebremeskel and Longosiwa did? Outsprint Lagat in a slow race?

    Leave a comment:


  • mump boy
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    While i too think that the time is irrelevant to the winner, i just don't understand those who have no chance of winning not wanting to make some kind of effort. Do they all honestly think they can outsprint Mo or Bernie in a slow race ??

    I would have much more respect for those who decide to go down in a blaze of glory than those who are happy to jog around at the back and end up where they expected in the firs place. What's the point of being there unless you play to your strengths ?? :?

    Leave a comment:


  • Tuariki
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Aaronk
    The athletes who care about setting best performances at the Olympics are those athletes who have no chance of getting a medal. Those athletes who have realistic chances of getting a medal don't give a frig about what time or distance they achieve - as long as they get a medal.

    All races from 1500m up are about tactics. In the finals for races 400m and below there is only one tactic runs fast as you bloody well can because you don't have time to play tactics.

    The 800m can go either way - it is usually a tactical race as well, except when you have the monstrous presence of a David Rudisha who gives the others no chance of playing tactics. He is, as others have said, the ultimate rabbit. Unfortunately for his fellow competitors he is a rabbit that obviously has never read the story of the race between the rabbit and the (7) tortoise(s).

    Leave a comment:


  • EPelle
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    aaronk, judging by your posts, it appears as though you were, in fact, looking for an Olympic record from the onset. You had a set pace pegged for the 1500m, stated how easy it should be to hit the splits you indicated and set an OR. History suggested otherwise. The race didn't unfold to your liking. You carried that same hope and accumulated grudge from even to event -- including the walks. Concluding with the marathon. Eventually lambasting the efforts put forth by the distance racers. Eventually, someone concluded that you should stop watching the marathon when the OR slipped from Kiprotich/Kirui/Kiprotich's grasps. Lamenting the lack of OR's was repetitious. And got old. Fast. In Olympic message board record time.

    The Olympics are also about PB's: improvement on place. Many will walk away from the Games happy they set an Olympic PB. Mo Farah set two HUGE PB's in the Games. Lifetime bests he can only equal going forward. He may run faster if he's in another Olympic track final (he may move up to the marathon), but I assume with all certainty that he's over the moon with the PB's he's already set.

    Leave a comment:


  • lionelp1
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by pickle47
    It is axiomatic that the athlete that leads early and the majority of the race gets beaten at the end. At this level the odds are that the early leader will not be on the podium. Can you imagine the pre-race meetings between athlete and coach? They talk about all the different ways that the race can go and the best strategies...and no coach tells their athlete, "Go hard from the gun and make them all hurt."

    All of the first seven or eight athlete in this year's 5k can run a 53 last lap, even off of a 13min pace. The odds are better to duke it out the last lap than to CERTAINLY go down in flames to the kickers after leading a lot of the race. Yes, there are exceptions, and they are just that...exceptions.

    John Ngugi in the '08 5k is a perfect example. He made it look easy, so why aren't all of the Kenyans running that way? Because he was unique. Filbert Bayi won one big race that way, and then he finished second to Walker and Jipcho every time after that because they knew how he would run and they prepared and out-kicked him.

    Team running is a great idea, someone simply needs to volunteer to finish second. How do you go to a gunfight and not save one last bullet when you are supposed to empty your gun on behalf of your team?

    The objective is to WIN, and no one at this level is trying to do anything but that the best way they know how. And the best way is NOT to try to run everyone into the ground unless you are vastly superior to the field. Sorry, unless you THINK you are vastly superior, because you never know for sure whether there is a 19yr old Ethiopian coming up that you've never heard of that can hang with you and blow your doors off. Just ask Mo about Daegu.
    Exactly so.
    The posts about times just convinces that posters with boundless recall about the past are stating the irrelevant; we would be wise to forget Diamond Leagues or the past.
    Any of the runners on the track for the 5/10K men and women races who had gone haring off for a good part of those would have lost out or more to the point thats what the athletes thought. By the way there never was any chance that Rupp, Lomong or Lagat would be up front making serious hard pace for others.

    Leave a comment:


  • 26mi235
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    As I wrote in another thread, this canard that a time well below a time-trial best means that the event participants were lazy or that it is not a good race is so bad that it is "not even wrong" (ask the physicists for the full implications).

    Further, to keep posting this notion after you have said it once is unnecessary because there is simply no content that is added by anything that is said; posting a dozen times in the same or related threads is an exercise that indicates a very narrow notion (understanding?) of the nature of competition. Summary -- I do not know of a top coach or athlete that is particularly partial to this notion in any way, shape or form, and if that does not tell you something then maybe you are 'tone deaf'.

    Leave a comment:


  • JayIsMe
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    The Olympics are not about time, or height, or distance- they're about PLACE. How many olympic medalists would trade their medal for a PR, or even a world record? I suspect the number is zero. Off the top of your head, does anybody remember what Rupp's time was in the 10k just a week and a half ago? Some do, most don't, but everybody remembers that he won silver, and how he won it. That was RACING and PLACING.

    Yeah the 5k times sucked, but boy there was some serious RACING going on over the last 5 laps, with an exciting finish. Who doesn't like that? Three guys will be described as olympic medalists for the rest of their lives, and I'm pretty sure that's all they care about. Fast times are a bonus, and there aren't many Rudishas in the world.

    Leave a comment:


  • Alan Shank
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by Gebfan2

    Okay, the pre-2010 Bekele is even more amazing, and the 2012 Farah loses to the 2008 Bekele. But any race that has 4 runners who finish the last 5 laps at less than a 60 seconds per lap average, with a winner running 4:58 while weaving in and out, speeding up, slowing down, etc., still fits my definition of "amazing--even though on the continuum of 5k races there are a handful of races that may rank even higher on the "astonishment and wonder" scale.
    Yeah, I thought it was a hell of a race. The 2003 and 2008 were better, maybe even '04 and '09, but these were all great races.

    I was just watching the last half of the M 10K, and I thought it was the least interesting of the four M & W 5 & 10. With four laps to go and the pace up to then not fast, they ran a couple of 66s, a 62 as they jockied for position, then bah-boom-bah. Great last 400, though. Different people kept taking the lead after the 14:05 first half, but they ran 2:47, 2:40 (that was Tadese, who pushed the '09 race under 27), 2:47 and 2:46.
    Cheers,
    Alan Shank

    Leave a comment:


  • Gebfan2
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by TN1965
    Originally posted by Gebfan2
    Here are the 1k splits:
    1k Koech 2:55.40
    2k Lomong 5:56.70
    3k Alamirew 8:42.95
    4k Gebremeskel 11:16.47
    5k Farah 13:41.66

    That's under 5:00 for the last 2k. What isn't amazing about that?
    Bekele ran the last 2k of Beijing final even faster, while leading the whole race in the last 3K, and still finished under 13. (And he closed in 53 with 3 sec margin.) With a 8:43 3K split, it takes a faster closing speed to be amazing.
    Okay, the pre-2010 Bekele is even more amazing, and the 2012 Farah loses to the 2008 Bekele. But any race that has 4 runners who finish the last 5 laps at less than a 60 seconds per lap average, with a winner running 4:58 while weaving in and out, speeding up, slowing down, etc., still fits my definition of "amazing--even though on the continuum of 5k races there are a handful of races that may rank even higher on the "astonishment and wonder" scale.

    Leave a comment:


  • Alan Shank
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by catson52
    "This notion that the 5000 runners dogged it because they waited to run 4:48 for the last 2000 (a world-class 5000 mark) and finished with a 52 is likewise either a preference set I am not in the least bit interested in or a misunderstanding of of the sport. None of top distance runners that I know hold the opinion you are voicing".

    Don't know where you got the 4:48 from - the WR is 4:44.79 and there are only 3 sub 4:48s in 2K races. Even Komen didn't run that time in his 3K record!
    Probably just a mis-type; it was 4:58, might fast.
    Cheers,
    Alan Shank

    Leave a comment:


  • catson52
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    "This notion that the 5000 runners dogged it because they waited to run 4:48 for the last 2000 (a world-class 5000 mark) and finished with a 52 is likewise either a preference set I am not in the least bit interested in or a misunderstanding of of the sport. None of top distance runners that I know hold the opinion you are voicing".

    Don't know where you got the 4:48 from - the WR is 4:44.79 and there are only 3 sub 4:48s in 2K races. Even Komen didn't run that time in his 3K record!

    Leave a comment:


  • odelltrclan
    replied
    Re: ¶2012 OG: m5000–Mo Farah 13:41.66 wins 5/10 double

    Originally posted by 26mi235
    This notion that the 5000 runners dogged it because they waited to run 4:48 for the last 2000 (a world-class 5000 mark) and finished with a 52 is likewise either a preference set I am not in the least bit interested in or a misunderstanding of of the sport. None of top distance runners that I know hold the opinion you are voicing.
    Thank you! A race finishing in sub 5:00 for a 2k and just slightly over 6:00 for the last 2400 should never be included in the same paragraphs as "dogging it". Those are good performances at those distances if those events had been run in and of themselves. To finish a race in those times, even if the first 3k is at fairly elite HS pace for that distance [8:42] is very impressive. Those athletes acquitted themselves quite well in that race and if you could not be entertained with that race, you should not watch another OG 5k again, because you are not a fan of racing, just the stopwatch.

    Leave a comment:

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