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¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

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  • #31
    Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

    AS, those were excellent pieces on Montsho. Thanks! I gained more from her race/this follow-up thread than what I'd ever imagined. Cheers.

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    • #32
      Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

      And the diamond trade is going to make the exchange rate pretty high, which will make the average income look high, but the 'index number' problem is not adequately captured by using the exchange rate to value non-traded goods. Thus, the typical living standard might be quite overstated using that $7000+ figure (and, aside from overstating the average, the median income is possibly way below 7000). Combining those two factors and the typically living standard might not be much different from Senegal.

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      • #33
        Video problem Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,8

        In the front page of T&F News site this race is advertised but it has a wrong link and shows a marathon.

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        • #34
          Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

          Originally posted by AS
          I presume Montsho trains in Senegal because of better facilities (i.e. the IAAF High Performance Training Centre)?

          (despite Senegal's moribund economy, they have certainly benefited from the nationality of the IAAF president)
          As well they should. The UK doesn't have a president in the IAAF chair and the organization has become a bit of a gravy train: Spikes mag existence and being funded by the IAAF, Spikes mag free for UK residents, website content/development, staff/employees of the IAAF...there's probably more.

          We have an international sport and we should do all we can to make the sport international. I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

            Originally posted by batonless relay

            We have an international sport and we should do all we can to make the sport international. I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.
            Are you suggesting that Montsho is the only African athlete to make a final ?!!

            Kenya is in Africa as well incase you hadn't noticed :?

            Without looking into it i would suggest South America and Asia are massively under represented compared to Africa
            i deserve extra credit

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            • #36
              Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

              [quote=mump boy]
              Originally posted by "batonless relay":1ilrvdci

              We have an international sport and we should do all we can to make the sport international. I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.
              Are you suggesting that Montsho is the only African athlete to make a final ?!!

              Kenya is in Africa as well incase you hadn't noticed :?

              Without looking into it i would suggest South America and Asia are massively under represented compared to Africa[/quote:1ilrvdci]
              For the second consecutive day on this same exact thread I have a challenge understanding how you draw your conclusions. I've looked into what you're stating and understand it's not a personal problem.

              Batonless stated, paraphrased for those up late in the UK and living Friday night on borrowed early Saturday morning hours: If there is a Montsho in Botwsana, there's a likelihood of at least one Montsho, a female 400m sprinter, in every country in Africa. There are in excess of 50 countries in Africa, and only one female sprinter (Botswana's Montsho) can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's (HPC being the key to what's propelled Montsho to success), as far as batonless was concerned.

              Silly batonless for having missed that fact that Rudisha is also African. And an Olympic finalist as well. Maybe the lights in your room are dimly lit so that you're really not seeing what you're typing late-night prior to you submitting your posts.

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              • #37
                Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                Wow the conversation really has strayed. I am a bit concerned about the assertions being made.

                When i said it is economics it was by no means a slight on botswana's economy or their people. Now it must also be stated that as professionals who have a relatively short career which is susceptible to variables like changes in global financial climate (sponsorship), injuries, the object is usually to maximize the benefits one accrues while capable of doing so. Some employ different strategies, some race often seeking smaller fees and prizes and using a volume basis for the acquisition of wealth. The larger brands utilize a different approach, they tend to race less and command higher fees etc. Notwithstanding the discipline is also important, you would hardly find a 10k runner running every week for 6 months. However you are more likely to see a athlete do a 100 or 200 frequently.

                Thus the question t_monk posed is a valid one in regards to the amount of races she does.

                Though someone said that she does this often and it leads me to wonder if this is a part of her coaches preparation/strategy to race alot early on? Would you race alot early and build on your weaknesses and possibly correct any flaws. Or Would you try to aim for a peak at a world's or Olympics? Both options have their values.

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                • #38
                  Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                  [quote=EPelle]
                  Originally posted by mump boy
                  Originally posted by "batonless relay":1z6csczj

                  We have an international sport and we should do all we can to make the sport international. I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.
                  Are you suggesting that Montsho is the only African athlete to make a final ?!!

                  Kenya is in Africa as well incase you hadn't noticed :?

                  Without looking into it i would suggest South America and Asia are massively under represented compared to Africa
                  For the second consecutive day on this same exact thread I have a challenge understanding how you draw your conclusions. I've looked into what you're stating and understand it's not a personal problem.

                  Batonless stated, paraphrased for those up late in the UK and living Friday night on borrowed early Saturday morning hours: If there is a Montsho in Botwsana, there's a likelihood of at least one Montsho, a female 400m sprinter, in every country in Africa. There are in excess of 50 countries in Africa, and only one female sprinter (Botswana's Montsho) can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's (HPC being the key to what's propelled Montsho to success), as far as batonless was concerned.

                  Silly batonless for having missed that fact that Rudisha is also African. And an Olympic finalist as well. Maybe the lights in your room are dimly lit so that you're really not seeing what you're typing late-night prior to you submitting your posts.[/quote:1z6csczj]

                  It's really not had to understand if you concentrate

                  The inference was that Africa don't get their fair share of medals !! because of neglect from the IAAF who are to busy squandering their money in the UK !!

                  It would be great he have a HPC in every african country and more african athletes competing at a high level in more events but to imply that there is some kind of conspiracy because a web magazine, free to everyone (no longer in print form) is published in the UK !! and money would be better spent on African HPC is ridiculous.

                  The comments were not confined to the women's 400m

                  I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals.
                  Despite the lack of facilities Africa won 24 medals in London, South America won 2
                  i deserve extra credit

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                    You're absolutely correct on the medal count. There's a definite, no doubt about it, deficiency in South American Olympic medals. And, your recommendation may certainly help enable the your sought-after result to come into play.

                    If one concentrates on the entire statement, however, and not only on the concluding remark, there's a whole 'nother inference to be drawn. batonless is crafty with his use of words, yet each word he chooses has a specific meaning and form a coherent thought—especially when he's well-behaved and the personal stuff doesn't get bandied about, muddying up his posts.

                    Given that he's a rational, coherent person who's definitely steeped in this sport, it baffles the mind how one could begin to imagine that he would suggest to you (and to anyone else reading this thread) that Montsho was the only African athlete to make a final. Even more bewildering when you threw in the part about Kenya also being located in Africa as if he hadn't noticed.

                    Originally posted by batonless
                    As well they [Senegal, which benefits from the IAAF's president's nationality] should. The UK doesn't have a president in the IAAF chair and the organization has become a bit of a gravy train: [batonless cites examples of where he believes IAAF toss away their money] Spikes mag existence and being funded by the IAAF, Spikes mag free for UK residents [inference: a magasine that costs money to create and distribute is being offered gratis on the UK], website content/development, staff/employees of the IAAF...there's probably more.

                    We [western world] have [at our disposal] an international sport and we [those same people with the motive, means and opportunity] should do all we can to make the sport international. [He continues by making a plea] I would much rather send real athletes [qualified, medal-earning potential] from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events [like the w100m, as he's previously used the Afghan who ran a 17-second 100m, as an example] than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one [qualified, medal-earning capable athlete] in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one [back to the 400m, as he was following a direct line of thought on Montsho] can make a global final? We [the ones able to diversify] may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.
                    I questioned your conclusion, because I'm also reading the posts, and, not dissimilar to your having seemingly queried batonless on something it appears he didn't state, you drew an erroneous one Thursday night when asking me if I thought African athletes were unusually greedy when I was specifically speaking of Montsho's incentives to contest more DL's than do her rivals.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                      I couldn't fit this part in there, but think it's worth mention: but to imply that there is some kind of conspiracy because a web magazine, free to everyone (no longer in print form) is published in the UK !! and money would be better spent on African HPC is ridiculous.

                      Sure, it is! I agree. Yet, again, I give him credit for being smarter than that. If he meant the print form, perhaps too much credit. Eventually he'll clarify his position.

                      The daily Metro newspapers which are distributed freely to tens of thousands of people in major cities here and there, certainly in the UK, and back home in Sweden as well, aren't doing too shabbily. The Metro is free to people like you, batonless and to me, because advertisers are footing the costs by spending money to reach people in a captive setting: with the paper when they're on the bus, on the metro, travelling the underground or sitting on the john. They've got your attention. It may (and I use that term very gently, not knowing the IAAF's operations) very well be that the IAAF set-up was similar, that's to say advertising kept the free "Spikes" magasine afloat to the persons interested in the sport and likely to purchase the goods/services offered by companies marketing to those kids of specific persons. If it was indeed similar to the Metro and he didn't understand that, perhaps he's learned something new. At any rate, I'm not defending batonless, I'm merely traveling down a road and seeing something of interest to which I found didn't mesh with my line of thinking. It's been known to have been erroneous at times, and every day one tries his best to improve.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                        i think you take things i say too literally :?
                        i deserve extra credit

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: ¶2013 Rome DL w400: Amantle Montsho (49,87WL)

                          [quote=mump boy]
                          Originally posted by "batonless relay":3mad0e3a

                          We have an international sport and we should do all we can to make the sport international. I would much rather send real athletes from countries like Botswana to get REAL training at HPC to give REAL representation and DIVERSITY to the events than have them unprepared and all go out in the first round while JAM, USA, RUS and KEN win all the medals. If their's a Montsho in Botswana there is probably one in every country in Africa. There are 50+ countries and only one can make a global final? We may need to build more HPC's, as far as I'm concerned.
                          Are you suggesting that Montsho is the only African athlete to make a final ?!!

                          Kenya is in Africa as well incase you hadn't noticed :?

                          Without looking into it i would suggest South America and Asia are massively under represented compared to Africa[/quote:3mad0e3a]
                          This would be one of those times when you should dial back your a-hole quotient and hold back on the emoticons. Well you should do it all the time, but trying to find fault with my post because it's me doesn't address that unequal resources lead to unequal representation and the steady weakening of our sport. Since I did say "More Montsho's...and that every country probably has one", name all of the Africans that made the final at 400m in London besides Montsho? Only 5 athletes from all of Africa made it to the semi-finals and almost all of them train at HPC or university facilities.

                          South America and Asia are massively under represented but they're not nearly as under funded and under-resourced as Africa and they're also WELCOME to send their athletes to the HPC in Kingston or anywhere else (some do; Loren Seagrave coaches Li the Chinese LJer), because that is what we're talking about: AS's comment that Senegal has "benefited from nationality of IAAF president". If you're pissed about my comment that the UK benefits disproportionately because of it's representation within the halls of the IAAF then say that and provide proof to the contrary. But, to take umbrage with my comment that it's MORE worthwhile to send athletes from countries that don't have the resources to train them properly to HPC's INSTEAD of allowing the UK to hog the tit of the IAAF for nonsense like free Spikes mags for all Brits, chock full of insipid "up/down" commentary, website consultancy, and who knows what else ... and then try to elide that into me not knowing that KEN is in Africa (when I'm clearly talking about countries that can't send qualified athletes to global events) gives me the impression that I've hit the nail on the head.

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