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  • Barshim/Stones/ and Digital High Jump Measurement

    Barshim's huge, clean, lots-of-daylight clearance at 2.41 last weekend may have been one of the greatest jumps of all time: (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXVIe0qWb5Y)

    Seeing that brought to mind Dwight Stone's recent column about modernizing high jump rules that was recently linked on the TFN home page: (http://www.runblogrun.com/2015/02/dw...ones.html#more)

    Stones suggests using light beams linked to computers to measure actually elevation above the ground in addition to the crossbar. The electronic data could be used for tie-break purposes.

    That system would upset purists and present a lot of issues in determining records (would there be bar clearance records and electronic measurement records?) and would it be possible for a jumper to brush the bar and have an electronic measurement lower than the bar height? Etc....

    I have my own views, but what do others think about Stones ideas? Are we better off guessing about how high or, in the horizontal jumps how far, the jumper flew in absolute terms or is the future better with traditional bar clearances and distances from take-off boards?

  • #2
    Two thoughts...

    1) That would remove skill as an essential asset, especially in the long jump.

    2) One of the great things about most sports in general and track and field in particular is that the same basic rules are in effect across all levels. One level might have more equipment to get it done, but it's the same game everywhere. This would fundamentally change the events, and tell me how we're going to do this in high schools and colleges.

    I think it's good argument fodder and nothing more.

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    • #3
      In one word: ridiculous

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      • #4
        Really, what would be the point of the bar at all. Just something to aim for? No thanks. If you have two guys that clear 2.30m. One guy clears it by a mile and the other barely scrapes over with a bobble. Is the former the greater jumper? Not necessarily. The first guy actually wasted his energy a bit, did he not? While the second, did just enough. Let's not take away gamesmanship.
        If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

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        • #5
          It's great idea, like taking 10m splits or 'basic' times in the 100 , for fan enjoyment; it just can't be used to determine actual results. Wouldn't you want to know what Bubka actually cleared on some of his monster jumps? 20'6? I would love to know what the HJers are clearing by laser.

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          • #6
            Sure, as long as they are not using those measurements to determine placing.
            If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

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            • #7
              Is he only proposing this for breaking ties? In that case, at the highest levels (only) it makes some sense because you get ties at the top places. In that case, it would not replace the bar and would not affect any recorded heights.

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              • #8
                God. Damn.

                Only time.

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                • #9
                  I'm with Atticus. They wouldn't count as a results but would be interesting to see.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by 26mi235 View Post
                    Is he only proposing this for breaking ties? In that case, at the highest levels (only) it makes some sense because you get ties at the top places. In that case, it would not replace the bar and would not affect any recorded heights.
                    Sorry, it makes no sense at all. The competition is about clearing a bar. The competition is about the spectator being able to see what the performance actually was - it is not able some intangible invisible light beam. As Atticus says it may be interesting as an after thought but that's it.

                    It would be a bit like having the fastest human sprinter being determined by the top speed as recorded by a speed camera during the 100m. Definitely interesting to know but that is not what the event is about.

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                    • #11
                      Can I repeat my one word comment I made already ?!

                      RIDICULOUS

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                      • #12
                        What if, for example, Barshim clears the 2.38 bar on his 3rd attempt and the laser says his clearance was actually 2.47. He then misses 2.42 three times. On the other hand Bondarenko clears 2.38 on his 1st attempt. The laser says 2.385 was his actually clearance. Then Bondarenko clears 2.42 at the first attempt. The laser says 2.425 was his actual clearance.
                        So does Barshim get the world record? Should Barshim get the win?

                        Stick to the tried and proven.

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                        • #13
                          Tuariki, I was clarifying, not recommending.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Tuariki View Post
                            What if, for example, Barshim clears the 2.38 bar on his 3rd attempt and the laser says his clearance was actually 2.47. He then misses 2.42 three times. On the other hand Bondarenko clears 2.38 on his 1st attempt. The laser says 2.385 was his actually clearance. Then Bondarenko clears 2.42 at the first attempt. The laser says 2.425 was his actual clearance.
                            So does Barshim get the world record? Should Barshim get the win?

                            Stick to the tried and proven.
                            Yep, gets's very dicey. Again, as I mentioned, it takes away gamesmanship and efficiency. Why punish someone for only jumping what they need to for bar clearance? IMHO you will see less higher heights potentially because everyone will have to "sky" over every height, not knowing which one will bite them in the anus later in the competition. Once rarefied air is reached, there's more of a chance of losing your energy.

                            If you want to use laser-clearances just to see true height, I have no problem with that but in no way should it be used to determine final standings.
                            Last edited by Dietmar239; 02-22-2015, 09:21 PM.
                            If you're ever walking down the beach and you see a girl dressed in a bikini made out of seashells, and you pick her up and hold her to your ear, you can hear her scream.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Stones and his cocommetators always say stuff like that, they don't even believe it's going to happen. A couple years ago one of them on an ESPN telecast said he felt the NCAA was probably going back to the two false start rule.
                              Bolt's last year...and my last year as a track fan, it's been fun

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