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  • #31
    Originally posted by ATK View Post
    Regarding the Mixed Sex relays suggestion, would that be in place of the current relay or in addition to the current relay?

    If its in addition to, wouldn't it be more novelty than anything? The top guns would be on the main relay leaving the alternates to the race (which would be pretty dismal aside from the US and Jamaica).
    Since I haven't seen anyone spell out what the format would be, why would you presume that Jamaica with be a serious contender? I doubt that Jamaica could even medal in a mixed SMR, and in a mixed DMR, they wouldn't even qualify. A mixed 4x100 would be a terrible idea because of the difference in speeds in the exchange zones.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
      Since I haven't seen anyone spell out what the format would be, why would you presume that Jamaica with be a serious contender? I doubt that Jamaica could even medal in a mixed SMR, and in a mixed DMR, they wouldn't even qualify. A mixed 4x100 would be a terrible idea because of the difference in speeds in the exchange zones.
      I was thinking of the existing relays not SMR/DMR. USA and Jamaica are the only countries, sprint wise that don't have a major drop off after the 4th person. (yes some exceptions)

      Also note, I'm not in favor of mixed relays at all as I don't see the rational behind holding them outside of novelty.
      Last edited by ATK; 02-05-2016, 11:30 PM.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by repmujhgih View Post
        4 jumps is too few, but maybe a middle ground would be putting a limit on total number of misses in a competition. What about 3 total misses instead of 3 attempts at a height. That way athletes could still enter at a lower bar, but it puts the premium on makes at those heights. A clean jumper would still get the 3 attempt rule at the high bar as the rules currently allow, but it would add strategy to a jumper that has early misses to possibly pass a bar and not risk getting their 2nd or 3rd miss if someone else has already cleared it on a 1st attempt.
        In Beijing's men's HJ final last year, there were 14 competitors. A total of 96 attempts were made with 59 misses in 1h:51m. The average for the 14 competitors was 6.85 attempts with 4.21 misses. 13 out of 14 made the first 2 heights, but only 6 made the third height (Bondarenko passed, but made the next height). Of the bottom 7, 1 failed at the second height and 6 failed at the third. The bottom 7 accounted for 42 jumps after 3 heights compared to 23 for the top 7. Had the field been reduced to 8 for the final, a great chunk of time and effort wasted at lower heights would have been eliminated.

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        • #34
          Thought it over. Mixed relays have no place at Olympics or WC's but would be a fun novelty at lesser meets.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by ATK View Post
            I was thinking of the existing relays not SMR/DMR. USA and Jamaica are the only countries, sprint wise that don't have a major drop off after the 4th person. (yes some exceptions)

            Also note, I'm not in favor of mixed relays at all as I don't see the rational behind holding them outside of novelty.
            But even if we stick to the current relays, you're looking at it wrong, since mixing the relays would give every country twice as many athletes to choose from. I've seen instances in the past where nations which couldn't field four studs of a single gender would be able to field four studs if they were allowed to mix the genders (eg. 2 men-2 women, 3 men-1 woman, 1 man-3 women).

            Also, in recent years, there are several nations that have been more competitive than Jamaica in both the men's and women's 4x400, so the Jamaica-U.S. rivalry is strictly 4x100 phenomenon.

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            • #36
              Strictly women's 4x100m to be more precise. The men's 4x100m is way too one-sided to be considered a rivalry.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
                But even if we stick to the current relays, you're looking at it wrong, since mixing the relays would give every country twice as many athletes to choose from. I've seen instances in the past where nations which couldn't field four studs of a single gender would be able to field four studs if they were allowed to mix the genders (eg. 2 men-2 women, 3 men-1 woman, 1 man-3 women).

                Also, in recent years, there are several nations that have been more competitive than Jamaica in both the men's and women's 4x400, so the Jamaica-U.S. rivalry is strictly 4x100 phenomenon.
                That's why I asked if it would be in addition to the existing relays or replacing them.

                If a hypothetical schedule has:
                mens 4x4, mens 4x1, womens 4x4, womens 4x1, mixed 4x4, mixed 4x1.

                The mixed 4x4 and 4x1 would be a bunch of alternates as the top athletes are already taken.
                Your right though that their pools would be doubled, but again I see the mixed relays as more of a novelty so I'm probably imposing my views on how nations may select their relay teams if such relays were added to OG/WC.

                Also, of the 4 relays, as you noted, mens 4x4 is the only relay where Jamaica is not a serious factor. Omitting Russia, the USA and Jamaica have dominated the other 3 relays for the last decade.

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                • #38
                  The format for the pole vault is fine as it is. 4 attempts per height would make most competitions drag. 4 attempts total, or any given number of attempts total is a horrible mess. They should have left the pegs and bar ends alone too, that did nothing to improve the event or the sport.

                  I feel like there is more room to tinker with the format of the horizontal jumps and throws... if you had a field of 16, gave everyone 2 attempts, then shrink the field to 8, 2 more attempts, then shrunk the field to 4 and 2 final attempts going for the medals... but I also like the current format just fine...

                  Mixed relays could be interesting to play with at the World Relays, not the Olympics or World Champs. It's entertaining if you let the teams pick which genders run when (if they are equal distances)... would everyone do F-F-M-M or would some mix it up? What if everyone had a female start and a male finish but it was random draw to see which genders would run the 2nd and 3rd leg?

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Atticus View Post
                    Four total jumps in the verticals would result in many, many no-heights as everyone would be compelled to try for winning heights vs. trying safe ones. Whoever went last would have a huge advantage.
                    Absolutely! It would mess up and ruin the vertical events as we know them. Who would gain? Not the fans.

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                    • #40
                      Well done GH for putting something up, which as you can see from the comments so far, hardcore fans will interrogate and pick apart!

                      Aren't all events once a novelty? How can we rule out mixed relays as novelty simply because they're new. Its this old school attitude that keeps athletics where it is and we need to retain our history but also move the sport on.

                      As for who runs the single gender versus the mixed teams, let the countries sort it out. As long as there are two athletes of each gender, let the teams decide on line ups where. Front loading your team, alternating, faster at the end - that's what would make this more exciting!

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                      • #41
                        Thinking more about it if you really wanted to capture the excitement of short track skating is to concentrate on the indoors. And I would advocate a really short track like 16 laps to the mile. I think it would be pretty wild. And with a track that short you could set it up almost anywhere. It could be a traveling road show....

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                        • #42
                          I am not so sure about the 50. Where would you start it? The obvious spot means half the stadium won't see anything.

                          I think the middle of the infield would be cool.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by booond View Post
                            3 and 7 are worthwhile the remainder... no.

                            Alligators patrolling the water jump in the steeple?
                            Kind of like the Fonz jumping a shark tank. Good idea!

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                            • #44
                              If it ain't broke, don't fix it. And I for one do not think it is broke.

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                              • #45
                                It's so broken it's hard to find the pieces anymore.

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