small man's shot put

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

Which is why the 'race' walk has to go. It's not about absolute excellence. The Ministry of Funny Walks will blow a gasket, but it's gotta go.

[Twister]

Re: small man's shot put

Actually, Master Track has age graded charts but they only help out in regard to age. So in say a 200m race people from all age groups can compete. The older guys run a shorter distance and the times get graded(90%, ect.). So really in your case whoever throws farther is the best, or whoever jumps farther, ect.

[Powell]

Re: small man's shot put

>Which is why the 'race' walk has to go. It's not
>about absolute excellence.

I don't see your point here - walking is about who is the fastest in covering a given distance subject to certain rules. It is very much about absolute excellence.
The 'certain rules' part applies just as much to running as to anything else. The usual argument is 'in real life, if you're in a hurry, you run', but how relevant, or true, is that? In fact, not very much. If you really are in a hurry, you will normally drive a car or take a plane, depending on the distance. Running has no more practical significance in today's world - especially if we're talking about running in circles on a track, i.e. not even getting from point A to point B.
Not that it is in any way relevant to this thread...

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

Well, in July 1997 at age 31yrs, 11 months, I PUT the SHOT (16 lb) 39'9" in a local decathlon and there were plenty of witnesses. I've went as far as 41'3" in warm-ups. I'm a spinner, not a glider. I did this with this all with a frame of 5'6", 180lbs and a bench press at that time of about 230 lbs. Most throwers under-achieve due to a lack of proper technique.

I hope this gives someone some perspective.

[197hjsteve]

Re: small man's shot put

related to all this talk of walking versus running, etc., what do all the swimming wonks say/feel about the breaststroke, butterfly, and backstroke? I know that as a general sports fan, I think they are pretty stupid..... JUST SWIM !
So I can see how people feel about Race Walking.

But at least "walking" is a normal human activity and as such has a certain appeal.

Any opinions out there on this swimming issue, as it relates to us in the & F world ?

[Twister]

Re: small man's shot put

You got me there, my technique is not very good. My bench is a shade over 300, squat about 450, deadlift 550, snatch 205 and clean and jerk 265. Lots of strength, decent speed(under :5 in 40 yds), bad technique.

[hammer forever]

Re: small man's shot put

Twister--
I encourage you to keep practicing and can't wait for you to post your Iowa Games results.
Keep trying!
Maybe try a "stand" shotput in practice just to hone your release at the toe board...then return to doing full circle throws. Is your throwing elbow high and parallel with your shoulder or does it droop down too close to your body, resulting in sub-par throws....are you doing a vigorous extension, utilizing your full reach when you release? Are you "opening up" as you come across the circle and dissapating energy unnecessarily.....I'm not a coach and after not throwing for 7 years my technique must be lousy, but I encourage you all the same.

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

What would be good for a guy 5'7" and 155? Well Andy Giesler is probably only a little bit bigger than that and he's thrown over 50' with the spin, Hart has also thrown far. I suggest if you want to see what is possible, check out decathlon results. (How big is Dan O'Brien, and he's thrown 54'!!!!) Shot Put is about SPEED, not size.

[gh]

Re: small man's shot put

<< Shot Put is about SPEED, not size.>>

It's also more about legs and torso than it is about arms. As a no-chested 5-9/152 triple jumper who couldn't bench more than 175lb I could hit 40ft simply by being able to harness the decent power in my lower half.

I never actually saw him do it, but former British recordholder Geoff Capes (a 71-footer) used to say that he would demonstrate how huge a part the rest of the body played by throwing 60-feet without using his hands! I guess he "used" his hands in the sense of balancing the shot, but he said he could hit 60 just flipping the shot off his shoulder. He was always a straight-up guy, so I bought the story. Anybody with more putting knowledge care to comment?

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

>It's
>also more about legs and torso than it is about
>arms.

Absolutely right! I can relate to the Capes story. I demonstrate to my athletes the same thing, although not 60 ft!!! Using just your lower body and never "striking" the shot with your arm, you can get quite a distance.

I've heard 75% of your throw is legs?

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

You're absolutely correct. Most of the throwers I was around had fantastic standing LJ's and vertical jumps, often better than the jumpers and sprinters. They could also move (see the other thread about AN). I have a vague recollection of Capes racing the top UK female sprinters in the 1970's over 60m and either winning or coming close (Sonia Lannaman or Andrea Lynch, I think). However, one of my proudest moments as a weedy 1651b HJer was beating Dave Ottley in an overhead shot throw comp, the year after he got Silver in the 1984 javelin! Don't remember Geoff chucking it 60' without using his arm, but I do remember him trying to overcome problems he faced with his head in major meets. He was taught to only concentrate on his fingertip action, nothing else, by the guy who wrote "The Inner Game of Golf".

[br]

Re: small man's shot put

I recall Brian Oldfield being pretty quick. Didn't he race women during the ITA days?

[197hjsteve]

Re: small man's shot put

marknhj's message rang a chord with me.. as a former hj'er myself.

My older brother and I built a miniature track facility in our back yard, with a sawdust pit and standards, a dirst HJ takeoff zone, a wooden board about 16' from the pit, and last but not least we built a dirst SP ring, then bought a 12 lb. shot put.

Getting too long here, sorry. Bottom line is that although my older brother was much stronger than I in the shoulders and arms, I could beat him in the SP because of my jumping ability !

I still have that shot put on my bookshelf. Great piece of memoribalia.

[Twister]

Re: small man's shot put

I talked to some college shot men that vert jump over high hurdles(42") in training. Of course they have to pull there legs up to go over, still a long way up for a big guy.

[Guest]

Re: small man's shot put

I will be a college thrower and use plyometrics (box jumping and what not)as a huge part of my training and use 42" boxes. Its not as hard as it may seem if you know how to jump so as to harness your explosive power. I am only about 6', 250lbs. so I guess it depends on perspective.