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  • #31
    Re: New Decathlon Topic

    >Question - why is Discus best so short/low score?


    My theory is: just look at the tables. DT is not a "get rich" event. Same for 1500. Big improvements don't get commeserant reward. Best strategy is to be competent, but not spend a lot of time on it. Bigger rewards in slight improvement in HJ & PV. I'll dig out what the WR ((open) would score in the relevant events.

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    • #32
      Re: New Decathlon Topic

      >When I started this thread, the performances I had in mind were really from
      >actual, serious decathletes, not event specialists trying out the decathlon.
      >That's why I particularly like the 400m and long jump.

      100, HJ and 110H are pretty good, too.
      How about a list of best performances ever achieved in an 8000+ pts. decathlon?
      Było smaszno, a jaszmije smukwijne...

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      • #33
        Re: New Decathlon Topic

        Somewhere in the great pile of decathlon trivia is a list of event PR's acheived in 6,000, 7,000 and 8,000 point peformances. I don't know if Frank Z. has such a list or if it is on the web; I just remember seeing it years back before Al Gore invented the internet.

        I think most of the performances in your original post came from 8,000+ performances; and I suspect there would not be alot of new records if you consider 7K or 6K marks (with the exception of the 1500; some skinny 6k guy probably ran in the low 3:50's).

        Anyone ever seen a list of 7,000+ or 6,000 records?

        Another interesting list would be the worst single event marks (beside DNF's) in an 8,000+ decathlon. There's some real stinkers there in the 1500, shot, and javelin.

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: New Decathlon Topic

          >26mi -- who could "float through the other nine events and then blister a 3:38
          >in the 1500"?

          Well ElG could. More realistically, McMullen might or might have been able to. It could be a 2000 point decathlon (with 1200 for the 1500). How much effort is it to jump over the hurdles or even PV, the other events can be done with almost no effort.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: New Decathlon Topic

            Mike, re "commeserant" -- it's "commensurate" -- I think this is one of the most-often mistakenly pronounced and used words in the language. I had a boss once who used "commiserate" frequently when he meant "commensurate". Hope you don't mind.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: New Decathlon Topic

              >who could "float through the other nine events and then blister a 3:38 in the 1500"?



              Canada's Gary Reed might be able to. I'm told he used to be a decathlete before turning to the 800m (which he ran 1:44.92 for in 2004). I don't know how good a decathlete he used to be, but if he put in some half decent performances for each event, he might be able to run a 3:38 for the last event. Maybe score between 6,000 and 7,000 ?

              Anyone know his Decathlon PB?

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              • #37
                Re: New Decathlon Topic

                Sometimes the vault causes them to be out on the infield baking for 3 or 4 hours. It takes just as much "effort" if not more than any other jumping event.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: New Decathlon Topic

                  Gary Reed finished fourth in the Pan Am Junior championships in 1999 with a score in the 5900 range.
                  Can't seem to find the eact results for that meet.
                  In that same year Gary won the BC HS Championships Decathlon with a score of 5,778.
                  He ran the 1500m in 4:39.65

                  If anyone has seen Gary they would not be surprised to know that his throws were weak. 24m in the Discus, 36m in the Javelin, 10m in the SP!!! He ran a 11.64 100m and a 50.9 400m.

                  Suffice to say that he is now in the right event!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: New Decathlon Topic

                    Originally posted by Jon
                    >I suspect the difficulty in mastering discus technique
                    >may play a larger role. If it was just body type, I would expect the scores in
                    >the shot put to be lower than the discus. (edited)


                    I think Hubacher's record distorts things a bit, as he was an actual shot putter. If we look at the results from this year's Olympic decathlon, they all seemed to score pretty much the same (between 700 and 900 pts) in both the SP and DT. In fact, the 900-point barrier was broken in the DT but not in the SP.

                    If top decathletes can master the technique required for running, hurdling, javelin throwing, shot-putting, pole vaulting, high jumping and long jumping, then I don't see how the discus would pose any extra challenge compared to the other events.


                    Same thing with women's heptathlon. Most of them score lower in the SP. And it's not because they are lacking technique-wise (look at JJK in 1988 and Denise Lewis in 1999). It's more a case of their bodies not being the right build for the event. It's no coincidence that the record holder for the SP in women's multi events (Eva Wilms' 20.95, pentathlon) was quite stocky.
                    Eva Wilms' 20.95m,the best tough ever I have ever see,can you image a heptathlete to throw beyond it? maybe the world has been destroyed :lol:

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: New Decathlon Topic

                      Originally posted by Jon
                      >I suspect the difficulty in mastering discus technique
                      >may play a larger role. If it was just body type, I would expect the scores in
                      >the shot put to be lower than the discus. (edited)


                      I think Hubacher's record distorts things a bit, as he was an actual shot putter. If we look at the results from this year's Olympic decathlon, they all seemed to score pretty much the same (between 700 and 900 pts) in both the SP and DT. In fact, the 900-point barrier was broken in the DT but not in the SP.

                      If top decathletes can master the technique required for running, hurdling, javelin throwing, shot-putting, pole vaulting, high jumping and long jumping, then I don't see how the discus would pose any extra challenge compared to the other events.


                      Same thing with women's heptathlon. Most of them score lower in the SP. And it's not because they are lacking technique-wise (look at JJK in 1988 and Denise Lewis in 1999). It's more a case of their bodies not being the right build for the event. It's no coincidence that the record holder for the SP in women's multi events (Eva Wilms' 20.95, pentathlon) was quite stocky.
                      Eva Wilms' 20.95m in multi-event,the best tough ever I have ever see,can you image a heptathlete to throw beyond it? maybe the world has been destroyed :lol:

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: New Decathlon Topic

                        I believe Clay owns discus record now. Eaton is a threat to break both the 110h and LJ decathlon bests.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: New Decathlon Topic

                          Schenk's 227 (7'5 3/4) was all the more impressive because he STRADDLED it.
                          If all multis (Olympic) are considered, Robert LeGendre's LJ WR (776/25'5 3/4) in 1924
                          Pentathlon is surely the best multievent point-getter ever.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: New Decathlon Topic

                            from : Frank Zarnowski: http://decathlonusa.typepad.com/file...rld-champs.pdf

                            Decathlon Individual Event Records
                            World Records (7000 point minimum)
                            100m 10.22 Chris Huffins/USA Atlanta(OT/USA)(8546)+0.9) 06/22/96
                            LJ 8.22 (26-11.75) Erki Nool/EST Tallinn, EST (8362)(+3.0) 06/15/96
                            SP 19.17(62-10 3/4) Edy Hubacher/Switzerland Berne (7405h) 10/04/69
                            HJ 2.27 (7-5 1/2) Rolf Bielschmidt/GDR Jena (7245h) 09/30/77
                            Christian Schenk/GDR Seoul (OG) (8488) 09/28/88
                            400m 45.68 Bill Toomey/USA Mexico City (OG) (8193) 10/18/68
                            110mH 13.47 Frank Busemann/GER Atlanta (8706) 08/01/96
                            DT 55.87 (180-5) Bryan Clay/USA Carson (8506) 06/24/05
                            PV 5.76 (18-10½) Tim Lobinger/GER Leverkuesen (7346) 09/16/99
                            JT (old) 81.76 (268-3) Lennart Hedmark/Sweden Spala, Pol (EC) (7522) 06/25/78
                            (new) 79.80 (261-10) Peter Blank/GER Emmelhausen, GER(7425) 07/19/92
                            1500m 3:58.7 Robert Baker/USA Austin, Texas (7583) 04/03/80
                            1st day 4738 Dan O'Brien/USA Knoxville, TN (8707) 06/15/94
                            4747 nwi Dan O'Brien/USA New York (TAC) (8844) 06/12/91
                            2nd day 4455 Dave Johnson/USA New Orleans(OT) (8649) 06/27/92
                            Total 9026 Roman Sebrle/CZE Gotzis, AUT 2001



                            That LJ will be a hard record to get. I know Dan O'Brien ran 13.3x in open HH. Doing it in a Deca is another thing, of course.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: New Decathlon Topic

                              If there are good conditions in London or at the US trials and Eaton enters Day 2 healthy, he is likely to break the hurdles record. Eaton and Beach also have a shot at the 100 and 1500 records respectively, though the probabilities are lower. I don't see the other single event records as under any threat at all.

                              On the 100: Adjusted for wind and altitude, Eaton's best 100 in the decathlon is .09 slower than Huffins' (adjusted) record. That's a lot of ground to make up. However, Eaton's adjusted open 100 at Berkeley last spring was basically equal to Huffins' record (10.279 for Huffins, 10.273 for Eaton).

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: New Decathlon Topic

                                Originally posted by DecFan
                                If there are good conditions in London or at the US trials and Eaton enters Day 2 healthy, he is likely to break the hurdles record. Eaton and Beach also have a shot at the 100 and 1500 records respectively, though the probabilities are lower. I don't see the other single event records as under any threat at all.

                                On the 100: Adjusted for wind and altitude, Eaton's best 100 in the decathlon is .09 slower than Huffins' (adjusted) record. That's a lot of ground to make up. However, Eaton's adjusted open 100 at Berkeley last spring was basically equal to Huffins' record (10.279 for Huffins, 10.273 for Eaton).
                                Beach centainly can do it,he ran 2.23s in 100m in hep with a score 6138p,wow

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