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Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Block

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  • #46
    Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

    Originally posted by Smoke
    Inger wasn't suspended,nor banned. It was caffeine which as subsequently removed from the stimulant list altogether.
    Caffeine is not currently on the banned list, but WADA does continue to list it as a stimulant that is being monitored.

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    • #47
      Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

      Originally posted by gh
      Originally posted by Flumpy
      .....

      Surely since the whole BALCO conflama and his name being all over it the IAAF knew exactly what he was?

      Why the IAAF did nothing about it I don't know.
      Because, fortunately, the IAAF doesn't have a lynch-mob mindset and acts on real evidence, not street chatter.
      you might call it a 'lynch mob mindset' i call it an accurate assesment of lying, cheating, thieves in track and field. there has not been one athlete caught in the last 10 years who i couldn't have told you about 5 years before :?
      i deserve extra credit

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      • #48
        Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

        Oh and can we add another to our list

        http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/athletics/9430384.stm

        quelle suprise :roll:

        (i'd never heard this before so forgive me if it's old news)
        i deserve extra credit

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        • #49
          Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

          Originally posted by mump boy
          Originally posted by gh
          Originally posted by Flumpy
          .....

          Surely since the whole BALCO conflama and his name being all over it the IAAF knew exactly what he was?

          Why the IAAF did nothing about it I don't know.
          Because, fortunately, the IAAF doesn't have a lynch-mob mindset and acts on real evidence, not street chatter.
          you might call it a 'lynch mob mindset' i call it an accurate assesment of lying, cheating, thieves in track and field. there has not been one athlete caught in the last 10 years who i couldn't have told you about 5 years before :?
          Perhaps, but you probably would also have told us about more than one athlete who was not, in fact, guilty of anything more than being suspicious to you. The IAAF and the anti-doping authorities can't rely on your suspicions or anyone else's. Every suspension must be based on real evidence, and every accused athlete must have a right to a fair hearing. I, for one, wouldn't want it any other way and I think most clean athletes would agree.

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          • #50
            Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

            Of course

            Flumps point was when all of us know about someone why aren't the IAAF or other authorities doing all they can to actually catch them ? :?
            i deserve extra credit

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            • #51
              Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

              That was exactly my point. I'm not remotely advocating a lynch mob mentality, simply that by the time suspicion has filtered down to the fans surely others in a position to do something about it must have known for a long time.

              It just seems odd that so often people that we know are cheats(I would say suspect, but let be honest we know) go about it for years before any progress is made in catching them. Maybe there is loads going on behind the scenes that we don't know about but it usually just looks like a really slow reaction by the authorities.

              Sometimes different agencies work together swiftly to catch someone (Dwain) but other times it take forever (Trevor Graham) and then even then it's last minute and messy (Kenderis/Thanou).

              I'm not suggesting it's an easy task just that often the reaction seems to be too little too late.

              My post was meant as a genuine question rather than an accusation.

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              • #52
                Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                The exact opposite is the case. The rumors lead the facts.

                As far as speed of prosecution, it's matter of that athletes country. And if said individual is cooperating. Dwain cooperated so everything went fast. Kelli the same. Others denied and fought and were involved in other cases AND were the sources that led to other bust.

                The Greeks are still fighting theirs.

                So it's not as clear cut. Rumors are just that.

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                • #53
                  Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                  Originally posted by gh
                  Because, fortunately, the IAAF doesn't have a lynch-mob mindset and acts on real evidence, not street chatter.
                  Does it? What about the target testing of Krabbe and Breuer, based purely on the lynch-mob mindset of ex FRG officials? I bet you weren't complaining then.

                  I really do hope Zhanna's medals are nullified. The problem is who they go to. I didn't agree with the Sydney no gold medalist approach before, but then I look at some of the names who would be upgraded and I wouldn't be comfortable with them getting the medals.

                  I wonder through the years how much these doped athletes have affected the motivation and performance of others? When you're a clean 11.0 woman and you have 3 doped women in 10.7-10.8 form steaming ahead, how much of that affects your form and performance? Remove those 3 dopers and you may have beaten your PB and run a better race. Perhaps it dragged some to better times. Who knows, but the whole race changes. If only the races could be re-run!

                  I really don't think much has changed in terms of number of athlete taking drugs since random testing was brought in. Indeed, doping seems as rife as ever.

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                  • #54
                    Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                    Originally posted by Smoke
                    The exact opposite is the case. The rumors lead the facts.

                    As far as speed of prosecution, it's matter of that athletes country. And if said individual is cooperating. Dwain cooperated so everything went fast. Kelli the same. Others denied and fought and were involved in other cases AND were the sources that led to other bust.

                    The Greeks are still fighting theirs.

                    So it's not as clear cut. Rumors are just that.
                    That's not what I meant Smoke. I'm not talking about the individual cases dragging out but the methods used to catch them.

                    If I remember correctly, once Dwain was suspected the UK authorities were informed and he was specifically targeted soon after. It was a quick and smooth operation to catch a cheat. Kenderis/Thanou had been suspected for years but it was only at the last minute before the Olympics that a concerted effort seems to have been made to catch them which ended up with huge amounts of bad publicity just before the games. Was anyone looking into Trevor Graham before BALCO? The whole world knew what he was up to.

                    Again this isn't necessarily a criticism of the authorities I'm just wondering why it sometimes take so long to target and catch some of the most obvious culprits.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                      Originally posted by Gabriella
                      Originally posted by gh
                      Because, fortunately, the IAAF doesn't have a lynch-mob mindset and acts on real evidence, not street chatter.
                      Does it? What about the target testing of Krabbe and Breuer, based purely on the lynch-mob mindset of ex FRG officials? I bet you weren't complaining then.
                      Are you suggesting they shouldn't have been targeted? Were they not drug cheats?

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                      • #56
                        Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                        Originally posted by Flumpy
                        Are you suggesting they shouldn't have been targeted? Were they not drug cheats?
                        Oh no Flump, I absolutely agree with them being target tested. My comment was to gh who thinks the authorities do not (should not) act on with 'lynch mob' mindset and on 'street chatter', yet they did in Krabbe's case (it was the prejudices of some anti GDR officials that started the campaign to target Krabbe...and it worked!)

                        I absolutely agree with target testing based on rumours and that is what happens in practice. If you had 'real evidence' you wouldnt bloody be hanging around, you'd ban them! The fact is, law enforcements agencies, intelligence agencies and such like, and the IAAF and WADA, ALL act on 'street chatter' because that's where you get the best information and is what helps triggers an investigation - it's not all about dodgey test results. It's a starting point that in the majority of cases is based on fact.

                        At our primary school we had a little box in the main hall where pupils were encouraged to post concerns. I liked to call it the Snitch Box. I think we should have one in every GP meeting changing room, at every championships. :P Then it should be someone's job in the IAAF to read through all the accusations....Flump or Mump is my recommendation, then they can target test as much as they want

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                        • #57
                          Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                          I completely agree.

                          Suspicious athletes should definitely be targeted even if the information comes from 'street chatter'. This isn't a lynch mob mentality just common sense.

                          Gary seems to be confusing an investigation with a conviction. No one is suggesting that anyone should be convicted of cheating because of gossip, simply that it's perfectly valid to investigate because of it. If no evidence is found then the case would go no further.

                          As mump said above there has seldom been a cheat caught in the last decade that we couldn't have named years before. If the authorities did ask us lot for suggestions I reckon we'd have a 90% succcess rate. Off the top of my head I can only think of 2 top athletes from the last few years that I'm 100% certain were cheats and haven't been caught. Everyone else got rumbled sooner or later.

                          I love your 'Snitch Box' suggestion and would happily take on that job for free

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                          • #58
                            Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                            Originally posted by Flumpy
                            As mump said above there has seldom been a cheat caught in the last decade that we couldn't have named years before. If the authorities did ask us lot for suggestions I reckon we'd have a 90% succcess rate. Off the top of my head I can only think of 2 top athletes from the last few years that I'm 100% certain were cheats and haven't been caught. Everyone else got rumbled sooner or later.

                            I love your 'Snitch Box' suggestion and would happily take on that job for free
                            The fact that most of the people you suspected were caught eventually suggests that WADA's informers are as well informed as you But even if you are sure that an athlete is using drugs, you can't realistically expect that evidence sufficient to banning them will be found within a week. These things take time.
                            Było smaszno, a jaszmije smukwijne...

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                            • #59
                              Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                              Kenteris is a very good example, he'd been running round avoiding IAAF and WADA testers for years, everyone knew but it took untill the eve of the OG when the IOC got it together to actually go after him.
                              i deserve extra credit

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Mark Block given 10yrs for supplying drugs to Zhanna Blo

                                Originally posted by Gabriella
                                I absolutely agree with target testing based on rumours and that is what happens in practice
                                Exactly. I remember looking at USADA's testing figures in the past, and the athletes who are tested most are/were the ones who (most would agree) were most questionable. For example, after '06 they really stepped up in their testing of Marion Jones. The Russian middle-distance runners were also tested a lot more so than some of their opponents. I think I remember Christine Ohuruogu also saying that she was tested a lot more after she returned from her ban. The doping authorities are led by their own suspicions, and rightly so.

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