Indoor 5000 Meter records

[gh]

On the national level he didn't, but Merrick, running for Penn, did hold the 5 mile course record at Van Courtland for ages.

Ahh, so now we're back to all-time lists that don't mean anything! (Sorry Walt, the devil made me do it! :twisted: )

[ed gee]

[.[/quote]
On the national level he didn't, but Merrick, running for Penn, did hold the 5 mile course record at Van Courtland for ages.[/quote]

Merrick's 23:51 at Van Cortlandt Park is still the college record for 5 miles, Fagan's 23:48 was for 8000m (46 meters shorter), ~23:55 for five miles.

[mcgato]

I dug up the McGranahan information I mentioned above.
Women's 5000:
1. Jennifer McGranahan, Unattached, 17:27.69

Not quite top 10.

[Conor Dary]

'Merrick was a very worthy link in the HS distance chain of Lindgren-Riley-Prefontaine-Merrick-Virgin.'


I remember the first time most of us in Illinois heard of Virgin was in the 1971 state meet. Merrick won in 8:48. a fellow from Glenbard West, Don Ellis, was third in 9:00, but in second under 9 was some sophomore...

Merrick also won the mile that weekend, in 4:07 or so.

[Conor Dary]

Merrick was indeed a super talent at the prep level (never confirmed it as a collegian), but I don't ascribe too much wonder to his running that well on a small track. At that speed--slow enough so you're not fighting the bends at all, while still gaining the benefit of the banking--not sure that people couldn't run as fast or faster than outdoors. There was a fair amount of evidence for that even down at 2M back in those days.

On the national level he didn't, but Merrick, running for Penn, did hold the 5 mile course record at Van Courtland for ages.

[gh]

Merrick was indeed a super talent at the prep level (never confirmed it as a collegian), but I don't ascribe too much wonder to his running that well on a small track. At that speed--slow enough so you're not fighting the bends at all, while still gaining the benefit of the banking--not sure that people couldn't run as fast or faster than outdoors. There was a fair amount of evidence for that even down at 2M back in those days.

[dj]

No, that was in the AAU meet on MSG's old boards. Breaking HSR of 13:37.8 set by Lindgren in the same meet in '64. Lindgren's mark worth roughly 14:05.8. So the Hudson mark sinks farther into insignificance.

Wow, than that is an incredible mark to run that fast on that little track. Dave Merrick is one of the great fogotten H.S. talents of that era.

Merrick was a very worthy link in the HS distance chain of Lindgren-Riley-Prefontaine-Merrick-Virgin.

[Conor Dary]

No, that was in the AAU meet on MSG's old boards. Breaking HSR of 13:37.8 set by Lindgren in the same meet in '64. Lindgren's mark worth roughly 14:05.8. So the Hudson mark sinks farther into insignificance.

Wow, than that is an incredible mark to run that fast on that little track. Dave Merrick is one of the great fogotten H.S. talents of that era.

[Oletimer]

Thanks for the clarification.

[gh]

It's relative to how much something is contested. To use a ludicrous example, if there was such a thing as the backwards triple jump and Christian Olsson went out and did 30'2 tomorrow, beating a 29'5 by Walter Davis, and then the next day I went out and did 11'1, should there be much significance attached to my being No. 3 on the all-time list?

That's a reductio ad absurdum, but given the dearth of indoor 5Ks both before and after Hudson, his mark loses a lot of relevance, as evidenced by how fast the top end of the 3M list is from when national-class preps ran at that distance.

It's not a put-down, just a statement of sheer statistical analysis.

[Oletimer]

relatively meaningless?

What is meaningless about running the third (or whatever) fastest time ever?

[gh]

No, that was in the AAU meet on MSG's old boards. Breaking HSR of 13:37.8 set by Lindgren in the same meet in '64. Lindgren's mark worth roughly 14:05.8. So the Hudson mark sinks farther into insignificance.

[Conor Dary]

HS indoor 5Ks are so rarely contested that an all-time list doesn't really mean much. Hudson may have been about the first prep ever to run one, but in terms of intrinsic value, his 14:29 remains far inferior to the 3M best of 13:37.0 by Dave Merrick, which is the equivalent of 14:05.0. Until a boy runs that fast the times remain relatively meaninless.

Didn't Merrick run that at Illinois's oversized indoor track?

[CookyMonzta]

Re: Indoor 5000 Meter records

If I'm not mistaken, I believe Gerry Lindgren ran 13:40.0 in 1964.

My bad! I just dug up my old Runners' World 1982 Annual issue. Gerry Lindgren ran two miles in 8:40.0 in 1964. Dave Merrick ran 3 miles in 13:37.0 in 1971, which converts to around 14:10 for 5K.

[CookyMonzta]

Re: Indoor 5000 Meter records

Any additions to these lists of the top 10 indoor high school 5000 meters?

Boys All-time Top 10 Indoor 5000 Meters

Brad Hudson 1984 14:29.28
Scott Fuqua 2002 14:39.74
Nurani Sheikh 2002 14:44.42
Mohamud Ige 2005 14:53.10
Aden Ahmed 2005 15:00.21
John Crews 2002 15:03.50
Isaac LaFond 2002 15:06.14
Sean Quigley 2003 15:06.77
Stephen Shay 2004 15:12.74


Girls All-time Top 10 Indoor 5000 Meters
Brianna Jackucewicz 2004 16:43.02
Cassie Hintz 2005 16:45.82
Cathy Shiro 1983 16:52.48
Cathy Shiro 1983 16:57.50
Alyssa McKaig 2003 17:09.08
Cassie Hintz 2005 17:12.27
Alyssa McKaig 2003 17:19.27
Lindsay Van Alstine 2003 17:24.89
Heather Zimmerman 1983 17:26.54

If I'm not mistaken, I believe Gerry Lindgren ran 13:40.0 in 1964.