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  • #16
    Originally posted by bambam1729 View Post

    No worries. It was not until the mid-1970s, and Montreal, that the IOC started formalizing the 3LA for NOCs. Prior to that time they were chosen by the OCOGs for each Games, so it was often done in the language of the host nation - example is OLA for Netherlands, which is Italian in 1960
    One thing we haven't covered in this thread is the codes for non-political, non-geographic collectives, such as the refugee team etc that aren't in ISO but are required for administrative/statistical purposes.

    Also, I believe Australia and New Zealand was listed by IOC under the combined nomenclature of ANZ in a couple of pre-WWI comps. Tauriki will be happy that NZ got two thirds of the letters in that arrangement reflecting their innate superiority!

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Trickstat View Post
      The 3 letter abbreviation that used to bemuse was AHO for the now defunct Netherlands Antilles. Then one day I realised it was Antilles HOllandaise and it made sense. I must admit Antilles Hollandaise does sound to me like something you might eat for lunch!
      Similar to Ivory Coast whose CIV comes from the French language word order for Coast of IVory (Côte d'Ivoire).

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      • #18
        Originally posted by El Toro View Post

        Similar to Ivory Coast whose CIV comes from the French language word order for Coast of IVory (Côte d'Ivoire).
        Although the nation's preferred term for their country is Cote d'Ivoire, not Ivory Coast

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        • #19
          Originally posted by El Toro View Post

          One thing we haven't covered in this thread is the codes for non-political, non-geographic collectives, such as the refugee team etc that aren't in ISO but are required for administrative/statistical purposes.

          Also, I believe Australia and New Zealand was listed by IOC under the combined nomenclature of ANZ in a couple of pre-WWI comps. Tauriki will be happy that NZ got two thirds of the letters in that arrangement reflecting their innate superiority!
          ANZ is a fairly standard abbreviation for Australia-New Zealand that you see down there (I've only been to Australia). However the only years they had combined teams were 1908 and 1912 at the Olympics, and we have used AUZ in Olympedia. I'm not sure the IOC really has an abbreviation for them.

          The Refugee Team in Rio 2016 had the unfortunate 3LA of ROT. It has since been changed to EOR for Tokyo 2020 (=Equipe Olympique Refugee)

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          • #20
            Originally posted by El Toro View Post

            If you read the purpose of the international standard, ISO 3166, it tells you that it defines codes for the names of countries, dependent territories, special areas of geographical interest, as well as their principal subdivisions such as provinces or states.

            Norfolk Island is a dependent external territory of Australia, so this is why it is included in the ISO 3166 listing as a separate entity.

            ISO listing does not mean that any particular international body will affiliate that entity.

            So, in the Olympics, a Norfolk Islander represents Australia because the IOC only recognises Australia, but at WC and CWG, he/she represent Norfolk Island because it is directly affiliated with WA.

            Norfolk Island has, until recently, been self governing and did not pay Australian tax or have entitlement to government payments such as pensions because it had its own immigration, taxation and social security regimes.

            Norfolk Island's status is similar to, but not exactly the same, as Gibraltar (a British Overseas Territory) in relation to the UK of GB&NI.

            You likely won't find any data for small entities on the WA site because the performances a so poor due to the very limited population. For example, NFI only usually sends one or two athletes to Oceania champs or Pacific Games and they are usually high school kids. The NFI national records here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...s_in_athletics
            So if WA is following ISO 3166 and affiliates /recognizes with "countries", "dependent territories", "special areas of geographical interest", and "principle subdivisions as provinces or states" why doesn't it give Scotland and Wales their own listings under their "country" tab?

            Do Wales and Scotland not want to be represented as such? Does the WA take into account individual athletes desires for representation? I mean there is huge population in NI that wants to be either separate from UK and or joined with Ireland. Can't the WA recognize who they want to? Or is politics and $$$$ at play as well?

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            • #21
              This is as complex and confusing as the center rail at Penn.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by proofs in the pudd'in View Post

                So if WA is following ISO 3166 and affiliates /recognizes with "countries", "dependent territories", "special areas of geographical interest", and "principle subdivisions as provinces or states" why doesn't it give Scotland and Wales their own listings under their "country" tab?

                Do Wales and Scotland not want to be represented as such? Does the WA take into account individual athletes desires for representation? I mean there is huge population in NI that wants to be either separate from UK and or joined with Ireland. Can't the WA recognize who they want to? Or is politics and $$$$ at play as well?
                Under the Good Friday Agreement of 1998, people from NI are entitled to Irish citizenship as well as British. Since then, I think that the majority of athletes from NI have opted to run for Ireland when the opportunity has arisen. A notable example is the Irish middle-distance runner Ciara Mageean.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by proofs in the pudd'in View Post

                  So if WA is following ISO 3166 and affiliates /recognizes with "countries", "dependent territories", "special areas of geographical interest", and "principle subdivisions as provinces or states" why doesn't it give Scotland and Wales their own listings under their "country" tab?

                  Do Wales and Scotland not want to be represented as such? Does the WA take into account individual athletes desires for representation? I mean there is huge population in NI that wants to be either separate from UK and or joined with Ireland. Can't the WA recognize who they want to? Or is politics and $$$$ at play as well?
                  You're getting the causal arrow the wrong way round. The ISO standard doesn't determine who an international entity can recognise as members, that's up to the entity, as bambam made clear with the IOC refugee team having an alpha code. The ISO just enables a standard reference method to a common entitity.

                  As for politics, yes it has an impact but it's not usually from WA/IOC/UN/CWG end, although TPE is not recognised by WHO for political reasons.

                  The then IAAF once had a member called the USSR because the USSR athletics federation represented itself to the IAAF as a single entity. That was USSR politics saying "we are one entity" not the IAAF. However, now that the USSR is no more, the 15 constituent republics are each affiliated because each one applied independently.

                  The same thing happened with Yugoslavia and will happen if Brexit leds to a dissolution of the UK of GB&NI. If this happens then GBR will cease to exist and you will have new WA members, SCO, ENG & WAL. You won't have a separate NI because it will merge with the existing IRL.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by El Toro View Post

                    You're getting the causal arrow the wrong way round. The ISO standard doesn't determine who an international entity can recognise as members, that's up to the entity, as bambam made clear with the IOC refugee team having an alpha code. The ISO just enables a standard reference method to a common entitity.

                    As for politics, yes it has an impact but it's not usually from WA/IOC/UN/CWG end, although TPE is not recognised by WHO for political reasons.

                    The then IAAF once had a member called the USSR because the USSR athletics federation represented itself to the IAAF as a single entity. That was USSR politics saying "we are one entity" not the IAAF. However, now that the USSR is no more, the 15 constituent republics are each affiliated because each one applied independently.

                    The same thing happened with Yugoslavia and will happen if Brexit leds to a dissolution of the UK of GB&NI. If this happens then GBR will cease to exist and you will have new WA members, SCO, ENG & WAL. You won't have a separate NI because it will merge with the existing IRL.
                    Thanks for your input - it helps a lot!

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by tandfman View Post
                      World Athletics recognizes UK Athletics as its member Federation, and it is listed as Great Britain & NI with the 3-letter initials GBR. The Commonwealth Games include separate teams for England, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Wales, Ireland, Jersey, Guernsey and the Isle of Man. All of these other than Ireland are politically within the United Kingdom, or GBR.
                      Has an athlete from Jersey, Guernsey, or the Isle of Man ever won a Commonwealth/Empire medal in our sport, let alone another sport?

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Trickstat View Post
                        The 3 letter abbreviation that used to bemuse was AHO for the now defunct Netherlands Antilles. Then one day I realised it was Antilles HOllandaise and it made sense. I must admit Antilles Hollandaise does sound to me like something you might eat for lunch!
                        I recall seeing a 1996 Olympic baseball game, and the Dutch Olympic Baseball team (which was the European qualifier) was stacked with players from the Netherland Antilles.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Halfmiler2 View Post

                          Has an athlete from Jersey, Guernsey, or the Isle of Man ever won a Commonwealth/Empire medal in our sport, let alone another sport?
                          Mark Cavendish won a silver in 2016. And a bronze at the 2006 Commonwealth.

                          I can't think offhand of any track people. Wouldn't surprise me if there was someone.
                          Last edited by Conor Dary; 09-29-2020, 10:08 PM.

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                          • #28
                            Churandy Martina won the Pan-Am Games 100 in 2007 and finished 4th in the Olympic 100 in 2008 representing the Netherlands Antilles. In the two Olympics since then, he has represented the Netherlands.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by tandfman View Post
                              Churandy Martina won the Pan-Am Games 100 in 2007 and finished 4th in the Olympic 100 in 2008 representing the Netherlands Antilles. In the two Olympics since then, he has represented the Netherlands.
                              and had no choice, since the Antilles was dissolved in '10.

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                              • #30
                                Zackly!

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