two tommie questions...

[jhc68]

Tommie Smith's website (tommiesmith.com) claims that he was "the only man in track and field history to hold eleven world records simultaneously"... I'm trying to imagine the basis for that statement.

Maybe 200m, 220yds, 400m, 440yds, 4x200m, 4x220yds,4x400m, 4x440yds,sprint medley m, sprint medley yds? Did Tommie hold all those simultaneously? That's still only 10 WR... other relays or indoor marks? Who wants to do the research to figure this out!?!

On a pure coolness note: was Tommie the first high-profile sprinter to compete wearing shades? I remember seeing him blaze an awesomely effortless looking relay leg (it was announced as a sub-44 split) in the LA Coliseum in 1967 (I think) while he was wearing some totally cool sunglasses (they looked to be RayBans). Anyone recall sun-glassed sprinters before Tommie?

[KDFINE]

He never held the WR in the 400 or the 4 x 400. Maybe there were some indoor records that are being counted. Charlie Greene was on the national stage before Tommie Smith and Greene wore shades. Didn't he give the line about needing them for re-entry?

[cullman]

Two of his records in 1966 were for the straightaway 220 yards and 200 meters. He did set the 4 X 400 WR along with Bob Frey, Lee Evans and Theron Lewis.

Livio Berutti wore sunglasses back in 1960.

cman

[EastBayprepoftheweek67]

Re: two tommie questions...

On a pure coolness note: was Tommie the first high-profile sprinter to compete wearing shades? I remember seeing him blaze an awesomely effortless looking relay leg (it was announced as a sub-44 split) in the LA Coliseum in 1967 (I think) while he was wearing some totally cool sunglasses (they looked to be RayBans). Anyone recall sun-glassed sprinters before Tommie?

Tommie was not even the first 200m Gold Medalist to wear sunglasses.

[cullman]

Almost forgot...Henry Carr wore shades too.

cman

[Gleason]

two tommie questions

On May 20,1967 Tommie Smith ran 44.5 (400 meters) & 44.8 (440 yards). He was in lane 3, Lee Evans (45.3 for 440 yards) was in lane 4 in a race at San Jose State.

Bud Winter set up posts at 110, 220 & 330 for lanes 3 & 4. I timed Smith in 11.0 for 110 yards. The T&FN article stated that those marks were his 8th & 9th world records.

Of course, he ran another WR of 19.83 in 1968 OG.

[tandfman]

So the 11 WR's include a non-record at a non-distance timed by a single timer?

[Gleason]

two tommie questions

So the 11 WR's include a non-record at a non-distance timed by a single timer?

No. His WRs for 400 meters & 440 yards were hand timed by three timers as was the rule until automatic timing became the rule in 1977.

I mentioned my personal experience verify my difference in a reply to KDFINE who wrote:

"He never held the WR in the 400"

I should have quoted him then. I agree that 110 yards was not a WR.

[KDFINE]

Oops and double oops for my gaffs on Tommie Smith in the 400 in '67 and the 4 x 400 in '66. So much for memory.

[gh]

If you want to get into wacky-distance WRs, during his indoor tour of the Northeast in the '20s, seemed like Paavo Nurmi was setting a "WR" at a diifferent distance (or two or three) every second night. I don't have time to go look, but suspect his total would be better than Smith's.

[Gleason]

two tommie questions

If you want to get into wacky-distance WRs, during his indoor tour of the Northeast in the '20s, seemed like Paavo Nurmi was setting a "WR" at a diifferent distance (or two or three) every second night. I don't have time to go look, but suspect his total would be better than Smith's.

I agree. One of the most absurd "records" that he set was for 2000 YARDS!!
NOT 2000 METERS which is rare enough!!

[rhymans]

Smith held 9 records simultaneously - 200m/220y turn, 200m/220y straight, 400m/440y, 4x200/220y, 4x400. So he was incorrect in claiming 11. Mind you stats guys like me were wrong in listing him as born on June 12, 1944 - he was born on D-Day 6/6/44

Nurmi simultaneously held the 1500, Mile, 2000, 3000, 5000 and 10000 in part of 1923-24 (he also held the 3/6 miles record at that time).

If you want to know more about Nurmi - look for the BBC website for a programme called "Great Lives" - where well-known people talk about their heros. This week it's Steve Cram talking about Paavo Nurmi and his career [It's a podcast on Tuesday at 4.30pm London time, 08.30 if your in California]

[Gleason]

two tommie questions

Smith held 9 records simultaneously - 200m/220y turn, 200m/220y straight, 400m/440y, 4x200/220y, 4x400. So he was incorrect in claiming 11. Mind you stats guys like me were wrong in listing him as born on June 12, 1944 - he was born on D-Day 6/6/44

Nurmi simultaneously held the 1500, Mile, 2000, 3000, 5000 and 10000 in part of 1923-24 (he also held the 3/6 miles record at that time).

If you want to know more about Nurmi - look for the BBC website for a programme called "Great Lives" - where well-known people talk about their heros. This week it's Steve Cram talking about Paavo Nurmi and his career [It's a podcast on Tuesday at 4.30pm London time, 08.30 if your in California]

I agree. He ran 46.2 for 440 yards indoors on 18Feb67 at Louisville on a 220 yard track. T&FN (Feb67, p.11) called it world records for 400 meters & 440 yards. Memory tells me that IAAF recognition of INDOOR RECORDS came about 20 years later. I think that it was a "de facto" world record if not a "de jure" world record.

[gh]

WRs (well, "WRs") set by Nurmi during his indoor tour of '25:

Mile
1.25M
1.5M
1.75M
1.875M
2M
2.25M
1500m
2000m
3000m
4000m

During a 4-month stay he ran at least 68 races (!). In his first 12 days he set WRs at 7 distances in 5 races.

[rasb]

That sounds like the Finnish equivalent to:

"Make hay while the sun shines."