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Originally posted by Jacksf
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That is not "beating" that is pummeling... but there was a rumor that Sime had caught a flyer and looking at that photo I am inclined to believe it. There is just no way that the novice Sime beats Morrow by a full yard (or more) under any conditions. My goodness though Sime looks like a beast.... nothing really ever changes my friend, new lines for old, new lines for old. -
Read the article from Sports Illustrated about the race.
They do mention a few false starts, but nothing about a flyer....I don't know....
http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/ ... /index.htmComment
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nice article. I assume that the 4.4 mph wind was a following wind?..if it was then all the elements were not as against them as the photo would suggest and the 9.4, while remarkable for a 19 year old relative novice, was not other worldly.Originally posted by Jacksf... nothing really ever changes my friend, new lines for old, new lines for old.Comment
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T&F News for August 1956 (page 5) notes "A series of Sports Illustrated Photos, taken at right angles to the the track in the Drake Relays shows that after the start Morrow gained one yard on Dave Sime".
3 months earlier Don Potts noted (May - page 6) "the atrocious weather conditions..took some of the edge off. The foting was very poor due to the rains. Dick Blair got a flyer and pulled Sime with him. That left Morrow a bit behind at the start; in fact Sime had somewhere between 2 and 4 yards on the US champ 15 yards out. Morrow managed to close that to a yard at the finish".Comment
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so does anyone have any information regarding whether this was indeed a 4mph following wind?.. if so that certainly makes up some of what was lost to the puddles and mud.... nothing really ever changes my friend, new lines for old, new lines for old.Comment
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Sime and Winder tied for 3rd at the '60 FOT and Winder went to Rome (as did Ted Woods who finished 4th in the 400). Neither made the relay teams although Winder was photographed exchanging handoffs with three others (don't have the photo in front of me) and he and Woods ran well in post-Olympic meets. So, it wasn't like they were injured and a reason was never given why they weren't on the relay teams. Winder was replaced by Stone Johnson and Woods by Glenn Davis. If the intent was to set WRs then, maybe, it could be justified but I would think the aim was to win and, with Winder and Woods on the relay teams, they would've done that (but of course the 4X100 relay fumbled the handoff as did the team from Great Britain - clearly shown in photos in at least one book going out of the zone - but they got away with it to get the bronze medal).
Going back to '56, it's my opinion that, had he not pulled in the NCAA 200, Sime would have beaten Morrow at the Olympics.Comment
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And the way he was running right before the Games, Leamon King might have beaten them both.Originally posted by BauchwalzerComment
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That's amazing; JRM and rhymans have "contributed" conversions ending up at 10.22 and 10.26, respectively [non-synthetic track] - those guys must have been a heck of a lot faster than the '72 crew!Originally posted by tandfmanTake good care of yourself.Comment
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I can't remember why Winder was replaced by Stone Johnson on the relay team but the US got DQed because the first exchange between Budd and Norton took place outside the zone. It had nothing to do with Johnson.Originally posted by Bauchwalzer
In the NCAA 100 final in 1956 Sime was healthy and fresh off his "dream" day in Sanger a week or so earlier. Yet, Morrow beat him by 2 yards in the 100.
I think Morrow would have won the 100 in Melbourne no matter who lined up against him.Comment
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I seriously doubt that Sime could have had as much as a 4 yard lead, just 15 yards into the race.Originally posted by rhymans
The Sports Illustrated article mentioned above, describes the event quite differently:
"But the third time they were off. Blair and Sime got away together, Morrow a fraction of a second late. At 30 yards Sime had pulled away to a lead of more than a yard and Morrow was on Blair's shoulder. At 70 yards Morrow caught Blair and, almost imperceptibly, began to inch up on Sime . But he didn't really get close."Comment
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1956 Drake relays.
I would take the T&FN Don Potts version over the Sports Illustrated version any time.Comment
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I agree with Per - Having said that, I'm sure the margin at 15 yards was much more like 2 yards than 4.
I believe that one of the reasons that Morrow was a more successful athlete was that he had a coach who specialised in sprints. Oliver Jackson clearly knew his business as a sprints coach [the relay world records attest to this], while Bob Chambers, the coach at Duke, was (I believe) more of an all-round track coach, having been a pretty good half-miler himself.
If you look at film of the two you'll see that Morrow was very disciplined in not getting vertical too quickly, while Sime often got upright too hastily.
Any sprinter in history would have looked poor against Hary over the first 10m of a 100 race, but Sime was awful in the first 10-15m of that race (the same is true of the OT race in 1960 - at 15m he was about 1/2 meter behind 7th place!). Had Sime worked on his pick-up and first few strides, then he would have won the '60 OG by about a meter
The fact that Morrow outclassed Sime (& King) in the '56 NCAA is a pretty clear indicator of who was best that year. If King had made the team ahead of Baker he would not have got close to Morrow in Melbourne. The Texan was fully recovered from the virus which had affected him in October, and King's nerves were generally not that good at big meets - and he'd never had to deal with 3 rounds before a final. He did run better than Morrow in the relay - but the relay final was his 3rd race of the Games - compared with Morrow's 11th race of the meet.Comment
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Movie idea: "Searching for Bobby (2) Morrow" ...Take good care of yourself.Comment
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Re: Rome, 1960: The Olympics That Changed the World
one more factorial mistake in the book on page 220, where Maraniss writes about the final of the 400 meter hurdles:
“Davis cleared the first hurdle smoothly, but he ……burst into the lead in the final straightaway before throwing himself across the finish line and spilling onto the track.”
It was not Davis, who did that: it was his teammate Cliff Cushman, who got the silver.
I wish only we could get a 'History of track & field' on videos with all the footage, which exists in old newsreels (especially from meetings in USA), old movies especially about the Olympics, footage from television channels etc., we could be without many of the myths, we come across in books writing about track & field.Comment
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Re: Rome, 1960: The Olympics That Changed the World
I've just been reading Marinass' book and I posted the comments below on a different thread, but they seem more appropriate here.
The 100m and the characters in the race feature prominently. It brings out a few interesting things that I had not heard about before. For example, I had not realised was that Radford was in a wheel chair for three years of his life (5-8) as a child due to kidney disease.
Marinass spends a lot of time on Sime and mentions that the loss was hard for him. Apparently for years he'd rerun the race imagining he could have won it if he had a lane next to Hary.
Another thing that is talked about in the book is that Hary wore Puma spikes in the final but on the medal stand he wore Adidas. Apparently he was supposed to wear Adidas in the final too and Adi Dassler was shocked to see him wearing the Puma's. Apparently Hary wore the Puma's as the brown paper package he got from them was a little thicker. He wore the adidas for the medal ceremony as he was trying to keep the brown package from Adidas.
I got the photos below from:
http://speedendurance.com/2009/02/28/ar ... -champion/
That blog talk about him trying to be paid by both sides too. I expect this is old news to many of you but it was new to me.
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