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  • Greatest Aussie Olympians

    As expected, Raelene Boyle figures prominently on the list, but somebody Down Under should inform the journalist responsible, ASAP, for a ridiculous blunder in her profile! Wrong woman in the picture:

    http://www.olympics.com.au/athlete/675/Raelene+Boyle
    Take good care of yourself.

  • #2
    Re: Greatest Aussie Olympians

    Originally posted by Mennisco
    As expected, Raelene Boyle figures prominently on the list, but somebody Down Under should inform the journalist responsible, ASAP, for a ridiculous blunder in her profile! Wrong woman in the picture:

    http://www.olympics.com.au/athlete/675/Raelene+Boyle
    Bad enough using a picture of Stecher. Also if the article says she was the only Aussie medallist from 1968 to 1976, that is wrong. Doubell won the men's 800m in Mexico City. Any others missing? In TF only, I would think Strickland would have to be rated numero uno. In all sports, Dawn Fraser gets my vote.

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    • #3
      So your drug accusations now extend to the West Germans as well, do they Mennisco?

      It's maybe time to point Annegret Richter, Inge Helten and a couple of lawyers from the DLV to this website...

      Raelene Boyle is certainly one of the greatest female sprinters of all time, although she did suffer from an occasional lack of self discipline - which led to the disqualification in the Montreal 200. She had already had a warning for a previous (albeit incorrect) false start, but in that situation she should have stayed on her blocks, as she would have had no problem qualifying.

      Would Boyle have medalled in the final? Yes, undoubtably. Would she have won gold? I don't think so. When Wöckel was on top form (which wasn't that often, to be perfectly honest), she was practically unbeatable. And Wöckel was on form in Montreal, just as she was 4 years later in Moscow and then again in the Athens European Champs.

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      • #4
        Re: Greatest Aussie Olympians

        Originally posted by Mennisco
        Originally posted by catson52
        Bad enough using a picture of Stecher. Also if the article says she was the only Aussie medallist from 1968 to 1976, that is wrong. Doubell won the men's 800m in Mexico City. Any others missing? In TF only, I would think Strickland would have to be rated numero uno. In all sports, Dawn Fraser gets my vote.
        Can't think of others, but then I haven't double checked either. Much ado was made over Debbie Ferguson making 3 consecutive 100 and 200 finals in Beijing. Didn't hear any announcer saying that last to do that over 100 meters was Boyle [68-76]. If, as the article correctly points out, she hadn't been incorrectly dq'd in the 76 200 semis, she'd have done it long before Ferguson. Further, Boyle won silver 2 games in a row [like AF] , second time behind the drugged Stecher - if Boyle had won 2 gold in Munich, and hadn't had to contend with a final full of drugged Germans in Montreal, she'd have the 2 consecutive 100 golds that were rightfully hers in the 100 - and another double [sans dq] with 200 golds in 72 and 76. Nobody clean ever finished ahead of her after '68.

        Of course this is contentious, and doubtless will get yanked, but at least a few people who are learning history will get the right perspective on it.
        I am a great admirer of Boyle's abilities and performances. But saying nobody clean ever finished ahead of her after '68, is a bit strong. Without checking stat books, I can think of a t least two people against whom drug charges are not often leveled, who did beat Boyle after '68.

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        • #5
          Re: Greatest Aussie Olympians

          Originally posted by catson52
          I am a great admirer of Boyle's abilities and performances. But saying nobody clean ever finished ahead of her after '68, is a bit strong. Without checking stat books, I can think of a t least two people against whom drug charges are not often leveled, who did beat Boyle after '68.
          You are correct. They aren't often levelled; I shan't mention names. But the origin of the initial levelling and the intuition available through experience of observing the sport for years [coupled with my monumental, sigh, IQ, LOL] are more than enough for me to be certain enough that we have a match. And of course, as I think you know, I was only talking about Olympic Games, not Commonwealth Games or any other settings.
          Take good care of yourself.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Rob
            When Wöckel was on top form (which wasn't that often, to be perfectly honest), she was practically unbeatable
            22.03 made her far from unbeatable in moscow

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            • #7
              Greatest Aussie runner who was also an Olympian?

              I'd go for Ron Clarke! That is what you meant, right?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by runforlife
                Greatest Aussie runner who was also an Olympian?

                I'd go for Ron Clarke! That is what you meant, right?
                You may want to add Herb Elliot into this mix... perhaps the most dominant 1500m win in Olympic history...

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                • #9
                  Give her some credit Eldrick:

                  22.03 was an Olympic record at the time, run from Lane 1 with a 1.5m+ winning margin. With this performance Wöckel became the first woman ever to retain an Olympic 200 title - and she wasn't exactly exerting herself in the process...

                  Maybe Koch could have beaten her, but then who would have put any money on Wöckel beating Koch over her specialist distance of 400m in 1982? Nevertheless, it still happened (Erfurt, 30th May, 49.56 v 49.87). And as you know, Koch went on to break the 400 WR in Athens only 3 months later.

                  Wöckel's 4 Olympic golds are often underrated, but her record speaks for itself. In any case, I would certainly have placed her ahead of an undisqualified Boyle in 1976.

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                  • #10
                    well, that's probably 21.95 - 21.97 in prime lane 4, but still a little lacking compared to the 21.7/21.8 of koch/ashford

                    she may have been 1st to retain title but in any boycot games you have to also set a pretty stupendous clocking to silence all the detractors - a slightly iffy analogy woud be the recent men's 200m - without tyson there, if bolt had won in 19.6/19.7, it couda been argued it was a hollow win by default - however, he put 19.30 into a wind, on the board - can't really argue for default win with that !

                    a mid-21.8 out of lane 1 wouda made her case a bit more "boltesque"

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by AS
                      Originally posted by runforlife
                      Greatest Aussie runner who was also an Olympian?
                      I'd go for Ron Clarke! That is what you meant, right?
                      You may want to add Herb Elliot into this mix... perhaps the most dominant 1500m win in Olympic history...
                      You're correct. I was only thinking about distance runners as opposed to the middle distances. Still, don't know why I didn't think of him.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by eldrick
                        ....- however, he put 19.30 into a wind, on the board - can't really argue for default win with that...
                        and Bolt and Raelene were clean athletes too.
                        ... nothing really ever changes my friend, new lines for old, new lines for old.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Rob
                          Give her some credit Eldrick:

                          22.03 was an Olympic record at the time, run from Lane 1 with a 1.5m+ winning margin. With this performance Wöckel became the first woman ever to retain an Olympic 200 title - and she wasn't exactly exerting herself in the process...

                          Maybe Koch could have beaten her, but then who would have put any money on Wöckel beating Koch over her specialist distance of 400m in 1982? Nevertheless, it still happened (Erfurt, 30th May, 49.56 v 49.87). And as you know, Koch went on to break the 400 WR in Athens only 3 months later.

                          Wöckel's 4 Olympic golds are often underrated, but her record speaks for itself. In any case, I would certainly have placed her ahead of an undisqualified Boyle in 1976.
                          Hi Rob! Long time no speak.

                          Wockel's run from lane 1 was certainly formidable - her 22.03 was just 0.02 outside her best at the time, and only Koch's 21.71 and 2x22.02 (the latter also from lane 1) as well as Ashford's 21.83 were quicker at that point at sea level (or near enough). I don't know that she could have beaten Koch though - look at their races in 84 when they were both at their best - she couldn't get closer than a metre and a half, plus Koch was second to none as a competitor.

                          For greatest Aussie, what about Betty Cuthbert? Isn't she the only athlete to have won gold at all three sprints?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Rob
                            So your drug accusations now extend to the West Germans as well, do they Mennisco?
                            I have no idea what you're not talking about. btw I grew up in Kitchener-Waterloo where they have the world's second biggest Oktoberfest [like anyone cares, except it is a lot of fun to partake when you're in your mid to late teens...] Your reflexive weinerschnitzelbobben reminds me of how hard it is to get one of those little old German ladies in costume up on a picnic table - just dangle a pint in front of them and they suck it all up.

                            :lol:
                            Take good care of yourself.

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                            • #15
                              How convenient that your earlier post (which accused Annegret Richter and Inge Helten of drug taking) has been deleted, thereby allowing you to claim innocence / ignorance.

                              Great form Mennisco.

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