Best Straddle high jump coaches

[cask1]

Who were considered the best US straddle high jump coaches when it was still popular?

[jhc68]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

I'd think Frank Costello was the most experienced and informed. But compared to V. M. Dyachkov in the USSR, most American coaches were just putzing around.

[Per Andersen]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

I'd think Frank Costello was the most experienced and informed. But compared to V. M. Dyachkov in the USSR, most American coaches were just putzing around.

Right! After Dyachkov/Brumel the US attitude to the HJ just had to change. Compare Dumas' run-up speed to Matzdorf's. Dumas should have come around 10 years later

[DoubleRBar]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

How about twenty years later? I always thought Dumas could have been so much higher with the Flop.

[dukehjsteve]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

[quote="jhc68"]I'd think Frank Costello was the most experienced and informed. quote]


I first encountered Frank Costello at an all-comers meet in the summer of 1963, when he had just graduated from Union, NJ high school. Jumping about 6'8", he was the best HS jumper in the NY area and bound that coming fall to Univ. of Maryland. Somewhat naive at 18 ( I was a mature 20 ) he was very surprised when I advised him that he would immediately be the first or second best jumper in the ACC.

The rest is history.. 2 scant years later he was NCAA champion. And it was my admiration that summer day at Van Cortlandt Park of his classic straddle style that finally compelled me to stop western rolling and start straddling. Thank you Frank !

[jhc68]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

DoubleRBar

I always thought Dumas could have been so much higher with the Flop.

Why? Dumas had an unbelievably slow approach run. I think it is reasonable to think that if he'd been a lot faster he'd have jumped maybe 3-4 inches higher as a straddler. But he was a slow straddler and may well have been a slow flopper as well.

[Per Andersen]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

Why? Dumas had an unbelievably slow approach run. I think it is reasonable to think that if he'd been a lot faster he'd have jumped maybe 3-4 inches higher as a straddler. But he was a slow straddler and may well have been a slow flopper as well.

A slow flopper like Andra Manson?

I think the US was just too big and widespread to have a systematic approach to effective straddle technique. Small, centralized Sweden had Gosta Holmer who had studied Steers' technique and concluded that Gil Cruter's dive straddle was the future of the straddle. That became the norm in Sweden. The Russians added weight training.
On the other hand. Would a Dick Fosbury have developed in Sweden? Extremely unlikely.

[Jackaloupe]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

Why? Dumas had an unbelievably slow approach run. I think it is reasonable to think that if he'd been a lot faster he'd have jumped maybe 3-4 inches higher as a straddler. But he was a slow straddler and may well have been a slow flopper as well.

Hold on; don't forget that Dumas was a decent Hurdler (mid-14s), so could've handled plenty more speed, in either style. Instead, he relied on his near unique, Lead Leg that he kicked up near vertical just prior to takeoff. He was well-toned all around, w/ good upper body control, so who knows? If yer gonna speculate, at least use all available facts, esp. before concluding that Charley couldn't have handled the speed, which isn't that great anyway.

BTW, Ashton Eaton uses very little of his speed, only picking up the pace in the last 5 steps, or so, after shuffle-hopping in to his mark.

[gh]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

Complete coincidence! But check this out.

from the September 1961 issue of T&FN, which I happened to open for reasons having nothing to do with the high jump. This from the Quotable Quotes section by Soviet head coach Gavil Korobkov (was not Brumel's personal coach

<<John Thomas definitely should be going 4 inches higher than he has done. If we Russian coaches were training him he would be up around 7-7¾ [2.33—at a time when the WR was Brumel's 2.25/7-4½]. I want to emphasize that I am not cricitzing American coaching in general. After all, we learned most of what we know from them.

However, they can be weak in certain events and I think the high jump is one of them. I don't care how you look at it; the entire trick of good high jumping is in a fast sunup, and in maintaining that speed in going over the bar.>>

[Per Andersen]

Re: Best Straddle high jump coaches

Complete coincidence! But check this out.

from the September 1961 issue of T&FN, which I happened to open for reasons having nothing to do with the high jump. This from the Quotable Quotes section by Soviet head coach Gavil Korobkov (was not Brumel's personal coach

<<John Thomas definitely should be going 4 inches higher than he has done. If we Russian coaches were training him he would be up around 7-7¾ [2.33—at a time when the WR was Brumel's 2.25/7-4½]. I want to emphasize that I am not cricitzing American coaching in general. After all, we learned most of what we know from them.

However, they can be weak in certain events and I think the high jump is one of them. I don't care how you look at it; the entire trick of good high jumping is in a fast sunup, and in maintaining that speed in going over the bar.>>

Oh, yes. I remember those Korobkov comments in T&FN very well. It helped me understand what happened in Rome the previous year as I was extremely disappointed with Thomas' downfall.
Sure, Thomas was slow compared to the Russians but, of course, faster than Dumas. But I'll take Dumas' bar clearance over Thomas'.