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All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

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  • All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

    We resume competition with the field events. For the long jump:

    Africa: Neville Price
    Americas: Ivan Pedroso
    Asia: Chuhei Nambu
    Europe: Peter O’Connor
    Pacific: Matthew Roseingrave
    UK: Lynn Davies
    USA: Carl Lewis
    USSR: Igor Ter-Ovanasyan

    And the results:
    1) Lewis
    2) Ter-O
    3) Pedroso
    4) O’Connor
    5) Nambu
    6) Davies
    7) Roseingrave
    8) Price

    Team scoring through 10 events:
    67 USA
    64 Europe
    58 USSR
    44 Americas
    38 Africa
    35 Pacific
    32 UK
    23 Asia

  • #2
    Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

    The shot put:
    Africa: Janus Robberts
    Americas: George Gray
    Asia: Bilal Saad Mubarak
    Europe: Udo Beyer
    Pacific: Les Mills
    UK: Geoff Capes
    USA: Parry O’Brien
    USSR: Aleksandr Barishnikov

    The results:
    1) O’Brien
    2) Beyer
    3) Gray
    4) Barishnikov
    5) Capes
    6) Robberts
    7) Mills
    8) Mubarak

    Team scores through 11 events:
    75 USA
    71 Europe
    63 USSR
    50 Americas
    41 Africa
    37 Pacific
    36 UK
    24 Asia

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

      Competitors in the high jump:
      Africa: Papa Gallo Thiam
      Americas: Javier Sotomayor
      Asia: Ni Ziqin
      Europe: Patrick Sjoberg
      Pacific: John Winter
      UK: Steve Smith
      USA: Dwight Stones
      USSR: Valeriy Brumel

      And the results:
      1) Brumel
      2) Sotomayor
      3) Stones
      4) Sjoberg
      5) Ni
      6) Winter
      7) Thiam
      8) Smith

      Team scores through 12 events:
      81 USA
      76 Europe
      71 USSR
      57 Americas
      43 Africa
      40 Pacific
      37 UK
      28 Asia

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

        The competitors for the final field event, the ever-popular javelin throw:
        I’ll freely admit I’m a bit out of my league, as this is the event whose history I’ve studied the least.

        Africa: Marius Corbett
        Americas: Emeterio Gonzalez
        Asia: Kazihiro Mizoguchi
        Europe: Jan Zelezny
        Pacific: Gavin Lovegrove
        UK: Steve Backley
        USA: Bud Held
        USSR: Janis Lusis

        The results:
        1) Zelezny
        2) Lusis
        3) Backley
        4) Held
        5) Corbett
        6) Mizoguchi
        7) Lovegrove
        8) Gonzalez

        Team scores through 13 events:
        86 USA
        84 Europe
        78 USSR
        58 Americas
        47 Africa
        43 UK
        42 Pacific
        31 Asia

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

          Naw, Stones is 4th while mighty mite Brumel (surrounded by giants!) beats Sjoberg on misses for 2nd and Soto wins.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

            Answer me this: How many undefeated seasons did Brumel have? How many did Soto have? I didn't just rank them in that order for no reason. Brumel was dominant and consistent, far more so than Soto.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

              Brumel dominated the era and was a nails competitor, that is certain. His 7'5 3/4" jump was one of the most memorable feats in HJ history. But even Brumel was not untouchable --remember, he only won on misses against Thomas at the '64 Games. And, his WR did not stand as long as Soto's 8 footer already has. When two equally great athletes jump against one another, size counts. Brumel could have been 3-4 inches superior to Soto at raising his center of gravity and Soto still wins just on the basis of body ht.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                Soto is one of the "dirtiest" competitors the event has ever seen. A walking drug factory.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                  The "only" drug that he tested positive for was cocaine and that was heavily disputed. Either way, it is not performance enhancing so it's not relevant to this discussion

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                    >Brumel's WR did not stand as
                    >long as Soto's 8 footer already has.

                    Quite true, but no one has invented a new and better way of jumping. How many straddlers have ever jumped higher than Brumel? Last I counted, just one. (T&FN should learn Chinese and change their records to show Ni Zhiqin instead of Chih-chin Ni.) No one has answered my question of how many undefeated seasons Soto put together. I'm just doing it off the top of my head, but I think Brumel had four.

                    I never said that this was an idealized competition. I placed them in order based on how they competed against their peers. Brumel lost only one major competition, when he was still a teenager. Soto lost many more than that.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                      uh, weren't Yashchenko and the East German dude (Rolf Beirschmidt - spelling is wrong) at marks significantly higher than Brumel

                      in the Boston Public Library main reading room there sits a very dusty old training book on the shelves from 1980 written by the Italian Sports Federation on how to train "like a pro" in all of the different events. A first glance might offer some "ooh, aahs" at the great frame photos of a Pietro Mennea start. But far more interesting is the section on high jump, where there is a detailed test based on height, flexibility, and speed on which style to choose. For the straddle there are great hand-drawn sketches of Yashchenko clearing about 7-6. What a graceful style compared to the flop.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                        >The "only" drug that he tested positive for was
                        >cocaine and that was heavily disputed. Either
                        >way, it is not performance enhancing so it's not
                        >relevant to this discussion>>

                        Not so, grasshopper. First, I agree with you that cocaine is not performance-enhancing, and I don't think it should be on any banned list (by track). Soto's positive weas "heavily disputed" only by Soto and the Cuban Federation. Just like everybody else from every other country shouts innocence to the rooftops.

                        That 2-year sentence (from the Pan-Am Games of '99) was commuted in time for him to compete again in '01. I think it safe to say that the influence of Alberto Juantorena as a member of the IAAF Council played no small part in that.

                        But poor El Caballo! The Horse backed the wrong horse!

                        In July of '01 Soto turned up positive for nandralone at a meet in Spain. Before that was made public, Soto announced his retirement, even though shorlty before he had said he would continue at least another year. When that positive was announced there was only muted whinging from the Cuban camp.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                          >That 2-year sentence (from the Pan-Am Games of '99) was commuted in time for him to compete again in '01.<

                          It was worse than that. They commuted it in '00 so he could compete in the Sydney Olympics.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: All-Time World Cup Day 2: Field Events

                            Well, it one thing to say the Soto is one of the "dirtiest" athletes ever, but who in the past 40 years do we point to as absolutely clean? The comparison that drew that remark was Brumel vs. Soto. Do we presume that Brumel was untainted by the old Soviet sports medicine system?
                            As for Yaschencko and Beilschmidt, they WERE incredible to watch and produced some amazing performances. As for consistency, according to Geoff Nelson's research, Rolf Beilschmidt jumped 7' 2 5/8" or higher 89 times...Yikes!

                            Comment

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