Big Event

[thedoorknobbroke]

Prediction: no one can get this without looking it up like I did!

[thedoorknobbroke]

Let me see.....
Robert Perdue ??
Robert Sanders ??
Robert Egg ??

Tuariki....carefully read my clue above and DRB's clue after mine.

[DoubleRBar]

In baseball, what is the call when a ball is hit out of bounds?

[tandfman]

All of these clues suggest that the man's name was Robert Fowler. Could be, but I don't recall ever having heard of him.

[DoubleRBar]

Yes, it was Robert Fowler that ran 2:52:45.4 on January 1, 1909. Most people have never heard of him.

[bambam1729]

Here's our bio on Fowler from Olympedia - hence the clue about Newfoundland:



Bob Fowler was a native Newfoundlander, whose family emigrated to Boston, Massachusetts in 1898. He attended school at St. Bonaventure’s Collegiate in St. John’s, Newfoundland. Fowler ran for the Cambridgeport Gymnasium, first entering local races in 1901. He competed in multiple marathon races, finishing second at Boston in 1907, third in 1905, 1908, and fourth in 1911, and was called “The Ancient Marathoner” in the local Boston papers. On New Year’s Day 1909, Fowler won the Yonkers Marathon in 2-52:45.4, run mostly on the track, but in -18º C. (0º F.) weather, setting a world record for the marathon, although it lasted for only 41 days. Fowler has been listed as American in the records of the 1904 and 1906 Olympics for many years, but recent research reveals he did not become an American citizen until 16 September 1907, so should be listed as representing Newfoundland at the 1904 Olympic Games. His representation in 1906 can be argued although he was part of the first formal USA Team in Athens. After retiring from competition he was coach at Williams College before accepting an offer to coach the Brazilian Navy’s track athletes. He later worked as an electrician at the Boston Navy Yard.

Personal Bests: Mar – 2-52:45.4 (1909); Mar (short course) – 2-26:42 (1908).

[Tuariki]

Prediction: no one can get this without looking it up like I did!

Tuariki....carefully read my clue above and DRB's clue after mine.

I carefully read your clue and then carefully looked it up.

[Master403]

As with many of DoubleRBar's questions, I gave up rather quickly on this one, but I use his puzzles to learn more about the sport.
One thing that struck me was how many marathons were run during this period. 50-60 years later there were only about three or four annual marathons in the U.S.
It seems there were two races within about a month of each other. On November 27, 1908 the Yonkers Marathon finished at the Empire City track in front of almost 20,000 spectators

https://www.nytimes.com/1908/11/27/archives/jf-crowley-wins-yonkers-marathon-irishamerican-runner-leads-big.html

The January 1, 1909 race was apparently billed as the Empire City Marathon, run in Yonkers.
What I am curious about is whether these races used the current race distance (noting that Boston was 24.5 miles until 1924).

[thedoorknobbroke]

I carefully read your clue and then carefully looked it up.

[bambam1729]

As with many of DoubleRBar's questions, I gave up rather quickly on this one, but I use his puzzles to learn more about the sport.
One thing that struck me was how many marathons were run during this period. 50-60 years later there were only about three or four annual marathons in the U.S.
It seems there were two races within about a month of each other. On November 27, 1908 the Yonkers Marathon finished at the Empire City track in front of almost 20,000 spectators

https://www.nytimes.com/1908/11/27/archives/jf-crowley-wins-yonkers-marathon-irishamerican-runner-leads-big.html

The January 1, 1909 race was apparently billed as the Empire City Marathon, run in Yonkers.
What I am curious about is whether these races used the current race distance (noting that Boston was 24.5 miles until 1924).

The best summary of the marathon craze of 1908-11, started by the interest in the 1908 Olympic marathon and Dorando Pietri, is in the book The Marathon Footrace by Dave Martin and Roger Gynn. Its about 35 years old but well worth the read. It has almost a full chapter on the years 1908-11

[LopenUupunut]

As with many of DoubleRBar's questions, I gave up rather quickly on this one, but I use his puzzles to learn more about the sport.
One thing that struck me was how many marathons were run during this period. 50-60 years later there were only about three or four annual marathons in the U.S.
It seems there were two races within about a month of each other. On November 27, 1908 the Yonkers Marathon finished at the Empire City track in front of almost 20,000 spectators

https://www.nytimes.com/1908/11/27/archives/jf-crowley-wins-yonkers-marathon-irishamerican-runner-leads-big.html

The January 1, 1909 race was apparently billed as the Empire City Marathon, run in Yonkers.
What I am curious about is whether these races used the current race distance (noting that Boston was 24.5 miles until 1924).

The race won by Fowler was at least nominally a full marathon (which is why his time appears in WR progressions - not that you can trust them completely when it comes to details like this!) Most of the race was on the track, though, and tracks in America at that time were usually measured 18 inches from the curb; probably in this case too, which would mean he ran a bit less than the full distance by modern standards.

The earlier Yonkers Marathon (won by Jim Crowley in a faster time) was described in the New York Times as "about 26 miles", which is a vague enough description; of course, considering the measuring standards for road races in those days, the vagueness is fully appropriate.

[mcgato]

Wasn't the marathon distance standardized around 1921? Before that a marathon was some distance around 40K. Trying to figure out records with no set distance is folly.

[LopenUupunut]

Wasn't the marathon distance standardized around 1921? Before that a marathon was some distance around 40K. Trying to figure out records with no set distance is folly.

"Standardized"; the modern distance was used fairly regularly before, and 40K marathons took a fair while to die out, though Olympic marathons were always at least nominally 42.195 after the standardization.

But certainly the unreliable distances are something that always needs to be kept in mind, and it doesn't help that many races were reported contemporarily as "26 miles, 385 yards" that are considered short courses by statisticians today. Matthew Maloney, for instance, ran 2:36:26.2 a few days before Fowler; and the distance was reported in newspapers as 26 miles, 385 yards; but it tends to get the short-course treatment nowadays. Albert Michelsen's Port Chester win from 1925 was similarly reported as full-distance and even appears in the official IAAF world-best progression, but ARRS gives it as a 25-miler.

[Master403]

The best summary of the marathon craze of 1908-11, started by the interest in the 1908 Olympic marathon and Dorando Pietri, is in the book The Marathon Footrace by Dave Martin and Roger Gynn. Its about 35 years old but well worth the read. It has almost a full chapter on the years 1908-11

Thank you. I will definitely track that down. For several years I would arrive at the USATF National Meeting with a question I had saved for Dr Martin, and he would always have an informative answer, leading to some great conversations. I don't know if I missed a thread, but I was sorry to hear he passed away last year

http://www.usatf.org/News/Dr--David-Martin,-78,-dies-after-long-illness.aspx

[bambam1729]

Dave was a great guy although I hadn't seen him in almost 25 years prior to his death. Strangely, he was not only an expert on distance running and training, but also on the high jump. I asked him how that came to be and he could never really explain it. Just happened. He had a very, gravelly, almost raspy voice, that Pete Cava and I used to imitate all the time and he would laugh his head off when we did it.