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What's going on with Shelby Houlihan? [can run in OT... back out]

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  • Originally posted by LuckySpikes View Post

    I know which I'd choose if I wanted to minimise the sanctions I faced!

    USATF need to do the right thing for themselves and the right thing for track and field.

    If Houlihan gets the TRO, and the meet ignores it, the meet director will be subject to arrest for contempt of court(and quite likely the judge will shut down the meet)

    There are no strings on me

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    • Originally posted by guru View Post


      If Houlihan gets the TRO, and the meet ignores it, the meet director will be subject to arrest for contempt of court(and quite likely the judge will shut down the meet)
      Well, USATF's lawyers need to get on the phone sharp-ish to the court and make it absolutely clear that:

      a) the court has absolutely no jurisdiction in the matter of Houlihan's ban from competition, a matter was decided outside US soil by a legal body that has no physical presence in the US
      b) USATF cannot be expected to knowingly flout international sporting law
      and c) thus, it would be unlawful for the court to impose a TRO in this case

      Make no bones about it, it will be an absolute disgrace if Houlihan toes the starting line at the OT and the US sporting community would be greatly shamed by such an occurrence.
      Last edited by LuckySpikes; 06-17-2021, 12:52 PM.

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      • Originally posted by guru View Post
        If Houlihan gets the TRO, and the meet ignores it, the meet director will be subject to arrest for contempt of court(and quite likely the judge will shut down the meet)
        Imagine! That would be a real test of BTC's sympathy campaign and if fans still stand with Shelby

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        • Originally posted by LuckySpikes View Post
          Make no bones about it, it will be an absolute disgrace if Houlihan toes the starting line at the OT and the US sporting community would be greatly shamed by such an occurrence.
          You must not follow American sports much!
          If she runs, it'll just be another Friday on the sportscape . . .

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          • Originally posted by Atticus View Post
            If she runs, it'll just be another Friday on the sportscape . . .

            Oh I dont know about that. Her story has morphed into something quite large, to the point that it's crossed over into general news across the country. She had a spot on Fox News, and her story made all TV news here locally, as well as the newspaper. Make no mistake - it's going to be a quite a media scrum there.

            There are no strings on me

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            • I hate it when self-important media folks, especially non-sports media, try to dictate to the governing body of a sport what their rules should be.

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              • Originally posted by polevaultpower View Post
                In 2016, Demi Payne competed at the Olympic Trials after failing a drug test, because an arbitrator ordered it, but of course the whole thing was secret, and remained so for over two more years! Probably set the precedent for Houlihan here.
                One thing to fail a drug test and another for CAS to rule unanimously against her after flunking the test.

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                • Originally posted by guru View Post


                  Oh I dont know about that. Her story has morphed into something quite large, to the point that it's crossed over into general news across the country. She had a spot on Fox News, and her story made all TV news here locally, as well as the newspaper. Make no mistake - it's going to be a quite a media scrum there.
                  Doesn't matter....it is rather sordid by BTC and Nike....

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                  • Originally posted by Tuariki View Post
                    What aaronk is doing is essentially accusing USADA, WADA and CAS of deliberately and jointly conspiring in contaminating the process against Ms. Houlihan, a good clean cut All American young female athlete would never in one's wildest imagination take ingest nandrolone.

                    And of course we never see aaronk making the same accusations in support of Russians, Kenyans etc who have been found to have taken some form of PED, because of course, in aaronk's mindset, they are guilty as sin.

                    And maybe, just maybe, Ms. Houlihan's ingestion of nandrolone was innocent. And aaronk's expressed diselief is perhaps understandable. However, the reality is that nandrolone was found in her body, unless you subscribe to aaronk's conspiracy arguments, and therefore she was rightly and properly found guilty because she was unable to provide any evidence to support her innocence.
                    WRONG and OFF THE MARK in a few ways!
                    1. About the Russians, I have stated firmly only that the Russians allowed to compete are "innocent till proven guilty".
                    I'm fully in support of banning Russians (or anyone!) who is using PED's!
                    I do find it abhorrent that an entire nation is banned (except for a few) because authorities believe in the "one rotten apple spoils the barrel" concept.
                    I see it as throwing the (innocent) baby out with the bathwater (the guilty).

                    2. About Genzebe Dibaba and others associated with Jada (Can't recall his full name!)--I've always said that I do NOT accept "guilt by association".
                    In Dibaba's et al cases, that is what I saw happening!!
                    She has NOT been charged with any drug abuse crimes!!

                    3. It's well known I DESPISE Salazar, and have thought him guilty from the get go of the charges he was finally banned for years later.
                    But I've never said his athletes were guilty of the same--not Rupp, Farah, Rowbury etc etc!
                    I've made it known I'm not a fan of the way Farah won all those Gold's in the WC and OG, but only for his tactics, NOT his association with Salazar, or believing him guilty of drug abuse!!

                    4. The main reason I don't rant constantly--or haven't in the past--about African and other non-American athletes accused of drug abuse is that I'm an American, and what happens with US athletes is my main concern.
                    I did NOT accept the brief suspensions of Gwen Berry and Ajee Wilson, or the non-ratification of Emma Coburn's 9:11.42 a few years back as the AR, but only because I thought a "tainted beef" excuse was valid, and as for Coburn, I felt it wrong that USATF didn't ratify her mark.
                    It was a matter of believing that some rules need to be excised from the books!
                    What Houlihan was accused of, and banned for, was so minor that a 4 DAY ban would have been too much!
                    It in no way "enhanced" any subsequent performance, so I question the motives of WADA and CAS, other than to protect their own reputation for pursuing clean sport at any cost!!

                    Houlihan's defense falls very close to Wilson's!
                    I see no reason to not believe her!!
                    She's always been out front and honest and has an excellent reputation amongst her peers!!

                    So don't paint this FALSE picture of me!!
                    Or of Houlihan!!
                    Last edited by aaronk; 06-17-2021, 03:13 PM.

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                    • regards who has legal authority where, recall that earlier this year an Italian judge declared the AIU/CAS position on walker Alex Schwazer to be null and void. It wasn't until the Swiss Federal Court ruled against him last month that the case was over.

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                      • Originally posted by gh View Post
                        regards who has legal authority where, recall that earlier this year an Italian judge declared the AIU/CAS position on walker Alex Schwazer to be null and void. It wasn't until the Swiss Federal Court ruled against him last month that the case was over.
                        But that is Europe....why would BTC and company give a toss about a Swiss Federal Court if CAS is irrelevant.

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                        • Originally posted by Conor Dary View Post

                          But that is Europe....why would BTC and company give a toss about a Swiss Federal Court if CAS is irrelevant.
                          i was merely pointing out that the U.S. isn't the only place where the legal system can take issue with CAS (and other alphabet-soup bodies)

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                          • Originally posted by guru View Post


                            Why? USATF has no choice but to comply if Houlihan gets a TRO.

                            One thing's for sure - the circus is coming to town...
                            Ever wonder what Pre would say about all this?
                            Talk about a circus coming to town!1
                            This is Barnum & Bailey at its best!!

                            GO SHELBY!!!!!

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                            • Originally posted by RunningInCircles View Post

                              Even worse, Houlihan is likely to finish in the top 3 and "make" the Olympic team. If there is still a legal injunction in place, then the USATF can't kick Houlihan off the team, but neither can they submit Houlihan's name to World Athletics/IOC as an entrant into the Olympics, because of the CAS decision.

                              Then of course the 4th place finisher would get a lawyer. This could get interesting, but not in a good way.

                              By the way, in case you haven't already noticed, the USATF has added Houlihan's name to the start list as the 11th runner in the 3rd heat of the 1500, which is taking place on Friday afternoon.
                              https://results.usatf.org/
                              Quite apart from whether she is innocent or guilty, Houlihan's potential (and probable, if she competes) presence in the final will change the tenor of the race. Do the others let her sit and kick? Do they run for top 3 or top 4? It will be interesting.

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                              • Originally posted by gh View Post

                                i was merely pointing out that the U.S. isn't the only place where the legal system can take issue with CAS (and other alphabet-soup bodies)
                                That is true.
                                Last edited by Conor Dary; 06-17-2021, 03:47 PM.

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