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  • #91
    [QUOTE=jazzcyclist;n1708267I don't see Biles as a victim. It seems to me that she embraced the fame and celebrity, she was no shrinking violet.[/QUOTE]

    She has a 35 city tour planned after the Olympics.

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    • #92
      Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post

      I don't see Biles as a victim. It seems to me that she embraced the fame and celebrity, she was no shrinking violet.
      I am with Lonewolf on this.

      And as you have no idea what has gone on behind the scenes for Biles over the past 10 years or so, your comments are in particular bad taste.

      And given the evilness of Larry Nassar and Steve Penny, nothing would surprise me, in terms of how Biles may have been victimised, thus leading to the mental issues that finally she was unable to cope with.

      IMO, what has happened to Biles, is a great failing of the US sporting system in not having available systems to help monitor the mental health of its elite athletes.

      Comment


      • #93
        Meanwhile...
        Nytimes.com

        Simone Biles to Miss Individual All-Around Final

        Biles will not compete Thursday night, U.S.A. Gymnastics said.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Tuariki View Post

          I am with Lonewolf on this.

          And as you have no idea what has gone on behind the scenes for Biles over the past 10 years or so, your comments are in particular bad taste.

          And given the evilness of Larry Nassar and Steve Penny, nothing would surprise me, in terms of how Biles may have been victimised, thus leading to the mental issues that finally she was unable to cope with.

          IMO, what has happened to Biles, is a great failing of the US sporting system in not having available systems to help monitor the mental health of its elite athletes.
          I don't see Biles as a victim (or some sort of martyr the media is trying to make her out to be) nor is she a failure or punk. It's just something that...happened. Sports has forever been about who can physically or mentally handle the situation in the moment.

          The timing is awful, though, and leaves her teammates scrambling. And I don't think making a hero out of her is the right thing. Not a heel, but not a hero.

          In all cases someone who in the moment is stronger/fitter/healthier rises to the top, and we have a new story/hero. That's sports and a lot of times the regular world as well.
          Last edited by scottmitchell74; 07-28-2021, 12:08 PM.
          You there, on the motorbike! Sell me one of your melons!

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Bruce Kritzler View Post

            She has a 35 city tour planned after the Olympics.
            Not after this week. ☹ And after Naomi Osaka's tennis flameout in the 3rd round on what was supposed to be safe turf, I don't think anyone's laughing. Remember what happened to Suzy Favor-Hamilton, who was leading the 1,500 in Sydney 2000 (ultimately won in a relatively easy 4:05) with 150 to go and in the midst of a kick, with the gold--certainly any medal--practically around her neck, until she inexplicably cracked up and collapsed at the top of the homestretch.

            At 24, this could very well be the last time we see Simone on the floor. 😥

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            • #96
              Originally posted by CookyMonzta View Post

              Not after this week. ☹ And after Naomi Osaka's tennis flameout in the 3rd round on what was supposed to be safe turf, I don't think anyone's laughing. Remember what happened to Suzy Favor-Hamilton, who was leading the 1,500 in Sydney 2000 (ultimately won in a relatively easy 4:05) with 150 to go and in the midst of a kick, with the gold--certainly any medal--practically around her neck, until she inexplicably cracked up and collapsed at the top of the homestretch.
              She wasn't going to medal anyway. Her collapse was after seeing multiple women kicking past her and realizing her medal dream was over.

              I just hope Biles can get well in time to medal in at least one event, in what will surely be her last Olympics.
              Last edited by 18.99s; 07-28-2021, 01:26 PM.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by 18.99s View Post

                She wasn't going to medal anyway. Her collapse was after seeing multiple women kicking past her and realizing her medal dream was over.
                I disagree. Favor had been outperforming those other runners all year and she looked better than them in the rounds. Anyone who was paying attention knows that something mental happened, she didn't blow up. Go back and watch that race and you'll see that the other runners didn't pass her until after she cracked, not before. It was as strang as anything I've ever seen in an Olympic final.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by scottmitchell74 View Post

                  The timing is awful, though, and leaves her teammates scrambling. And I don't think making a hero out of her is the right thing. Not a heel, but not a hero.
                  She wasn't ready to compete and would've hurt her teammates by dragging down their score. By stepping off she took an anchor away and they performed well enough to keep the silver. They likely weren't getting the gold after the prelims.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by Tuariki View Post

                    I am with Lonewolf on this.

                    And as you have no idea what has gone on behind the scenes for Biles over the past 10 years or so, your comments are in particular bad taste.

                    And given the evilness of Larry Nassar and Steve Penny, nothing would surprise me, in terms of how Biles may have been victimised, thus leading to the mental issues that finally she was unable to cope with.

                    IMO, what has happened to Biles, is a great failing of the US sporting system in not having available systems to help monitor the mental health of its elite athletes.
                    As I asked earlier, how many death threats a day does she receive over social media? I'll bet it isn't an insignificant number. It's a different world than 1980, 1990, 2000.

                    Especially this year where it has become fashionable in some circles to root against the USA from inside the USA.
                    Last edited by booond; 07-28-2021, 02:00 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post

                      I disagree. Favor had been outperforming those other runners all year and she looked better than them in the rounds. Anyone who was paying attention knows that something mental happened, she didn't blow up. Go back and watch that race and you'll see that the other runners didn't pass her until after she cracked, not before. It was as strang as anything I've ever seen in an Olympic final.
                      I use crackup/blow-up almost interchangeably; in one instance, it could be physical; in another, it could be mental; and on rare occasions, it could be both. In Suzy's case, she had a split-second mental blowup, where at one point she was leading, and in another she fell back rapidly and collapsed.

                      And lest we forget, Suzy took out quite a few of those ladies in 3:57.40 in Oslo that summer. Her Sydney collapse cost her a spot in the world top 10 rankings in the 1,500.
                      Last edited by CookyMonzta; 07-28-2021, 02:20 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post
                        Anyone who was paying attention knows that something mental happened, she didn't blow up. Go back and watch that race and you'll see that the other runners didn't pass her until after she cracked, not before.
                        I just watched it. At least 3 women already passed her before her collapse began (but she was slowing down due to fatigue before they passed her). She also explained that she panicked after seeing them pass her and then decided to fall.

                        https://womeninwisconsin.org/profile...avor-hamilton/
                        She explained that as she was passed by three other runners and realized she would not win a medal, she had an attack of panic and intense anxiety and thought to herself, “Just fall,” and she did.
                        There are more of her own words in this other article linked below, but it's behind a paywall (you may be able to read what she said during the seconds before the subscription popup covers the screen).
                        https://madison.com/news/suzy-favor-...fb0520b78.html

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by jazzcyclist View Post

                          I disagree. Favor had been outperforming those other runners all year and she looked better than them in the rounds. Anyone who was paying attention knows that something mental happened, she didn't blow up. Go back and watch that race and you'll see that the other runners didn't pass her until after she cracked, not before. It was as strang as anything I've ever seen in an Olympic final.
                          I disagree. She began to struggle after she was passed as any other runner who had run out of gas. She fell when about 8 runners went by her. They had just run a pretty quick 600-700m at that point.

                          Comment


                          • It was five athletes who passed her before she dropped to the track. She physically could've finished but mentally likely couldn't take the defeat.sydney2004.png

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                            • Originally posted by CookyMonzta View Post

                              No. She already had that, after winning gold in 2016 and never losing a World Championship she entered. At the moment, she is where Nadia was in 1980. And by the way, Mary Lou retired after Los Angeles 1984 (or was it 1985 or '86?).
                              Retton retired after the American Cup in spring of 1985. I don't know if that was the plan, or she realized she decided to quit because she couldn't compete with the world's best. Either way, it was a smart marketing move.

                              Comaneci had a growth spurt in 1977-78, and lost badly in the 1978 Worlds. She reinvented herself to win the Europeans in 1979, but then was forced to withdraw midway through the Worlds later that year due to a wrist injury. Yet she almost won the AA title in Moscow. She deserves a lot of credit for resilience, but I guess quitting was not an option under the Romanian system at the time.

                              Korbut didn't win anything except the "imagination" of TV audience, so she really does not belong in the conversation. (Neither does Retton, for that matter.)

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Atticus View Post
                                Agreed.

                                It will still go down as one of the most 'fraught', but as mentioned above, Munich takes the cake for 'worst' - it was also the coming-out party for the Steroid Era.
                                As far as the overall competition, Moscow was the worst Olympics in my lifetime.

                                For women's gymnastics in particular, LA was the absolute worst. Not even close.

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