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  • #31
    Originally posted by Trickstat View Post

    I remember attending league inter-club matches at 2 grass tracks in the '70s and '80s. One was at King's Lynn in Norfolk and the other at Haslemere. King's Lynn now has an all-weather track.
    Was the Haslemere track at Woolmer Hill School? There's still a grass track there based on online satellite imagery and photos from:

    http://www.runtrackdir.com/details.asp?track=haslemere

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    • #32
      One thing Fortius19 won't have to worry about is this comment regarding a sports field redevelopment at the University of Manchester:

      The 32-week project faced a number of challenges, including the first task which was to carry out a thorough sweep of the site to show that it was clear of unexploded bombs.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by El Toro View Post

        Was the Haslemere track at Woolmer Hill School? There's still a grass track there based on online satellite imagery and photos from:

        http://www.runtrackdir.com/details.asp?track=haslemere
        Yes I'm pretty sure that's the one. There was a 400m grass track at the time and no synthetic surface.

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        • #34
          OK, the most data based method I can think of to formulate grass vis-a-vis synthetic conversions is to utilize results from the annual Stawell Gift 120 meter race held annually in Australia.
          Stawell is retro event run in over a flat, well curated grass course since 1878.
          There is betting on the race so contestants are handicapped by the distance they run (in the same sense that race horses are handicapped by the weight they carry) so in theory, in a perfect world, all contestants would finish in a dead heat.
          Thus, a world class sprinter might have to run the entire 120 meters, while a 75 year old geezer like me might start 60 meters down the track.
          Only two runners have ever won from "scratch", meaning they finished first after running the entire 120 meters.
          Warren Edmonson came close but ran 118.74 meters.
          Jean Louis Ravelomanantsoa (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udr72DEf6cA) and Josh Ross (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMK42e2YOY0).
          Both Ross (PR=10.08) and Ravelo (PR=a windy 10.18) were Olympic 100 meter semi-finalists.
          Ravelo won the Stawell 120m in 12.0 (apparently hand-timed) and Ross won thirty years later at 12.36 electronically timed.
          SO, all that needs to be done is to play with these results to derive ratios for the conversion, then factor in the actual distance to be covered and somehow decide how the grass in question compares with the immaculate Stawell grounds and there you have it.
          I'll leave the math to someone who won't get an excedrine headache figuring it out.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by jc203 View Post
            Stawell is retro event run in over a flat, well curated grass course since 1878.
            The track actually rises about one metre over the 120 metres, so you need to account for that as well as the wind and amount of moisture in the track, which brings us back to the second post in the thread.

            Who knows, maybe there's a synthetic track with that sort of rise where a lot of athletes have been timed over 120m...

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            • #36
              Forgot to mention that the current Gift venue has only been in use since 1898 and it's degree of level has changed over time as well but I'm not sure about the rise. I have it in my mind that they reduced it slightly but can't find any confirmation on that.

              Still, that's still plenty of time if you can account for all the other variables.

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              • #37
                Talking about Ravelo, there's video of his historic 1975 win on a wet weekend:

                https://youtu.be/Udr72DEf6cA

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                • #38
                  I was lucky to be on the track at Westmont College during a couple of Jean-Louis' workouts back in the day. Little guy with a HUGE start... so quick and then massive acceleration. Amazing to see up close.

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                  • #39
                    Just do a single all out time trial on your grass training surface and the same on a track on the same day with full recovery and compare. Just do a straight run instead of the tight curves on the rugby pitch, so maybe a 120 or 130 and extrapolate from there. Then you will know exactly what it does to you and your running.

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                    • #40
                      So, my session on grass today was supposed to be 4x25secs (2mins rest between each) then 2x15 secs and 2x10 secs.
                      All was good, achilles fine, felt strong and fast, and then last 10secs rep....pop...there goes the hamstring.

                      FML.

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                      • #41
                        The 32-week project faced a number of challenges, including the first task which was to carry out a thorough sweep of the site to show that it was clear of unexploded bombs.
                        Wow, that certainly puts a perspective on things.

                        Thanks El Toro for those other links in post #20! This is turning out to be quite a larger project than I thought at first. The resistance from the soccer people is nuts.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Wiederganger View Post
                          So, my session on grass today was supposed to be 4x25secs (2mins rest between each) then 2x15 secs and 2x10 secs.
                          All was good, achilles fine, felt strong and fast, and then last 10secs rep....pop...there goes the hamstring.

                          FML.
                          Sorry to hear that. Heal up strong! Do you compete?

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Fortius19 View Post
                            This is turning out to be quite a larger project than I thought at first.
                            These things always are. Make sure you apply that new found knowledge to your assessment of the ongoing maintenance effort as well. A detailed spreadsheet of every issue and cost is important along with a realistic assessment of time and money.

                            It's too easy to get carried away with enthusiasm at the beginning and create a monster that needs constant feeding. This is especially true if you have an enthusiastic team - that situation is hard to maintain.

                            You need to plan for half as many people, half as motivated as the best possible upper limit of operating capacity. There will be times when even that seems optimistic.

                            My old club closed down a few years ago in large part because of the burden of club organisation and track maintenance eventually fell to just a few people for too long a period.

                            Originally posted by Fortius19 View Post
                            The resistance from the soccer people is nuts.
                            I'd rather deal with UXO than share a venue with a team sport. The track is just time and effort that gives you back what you put in. Dealing with another organisation is political and political situations also require time and effort but with no guarantee that you get anything out of it.








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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Fortius19 View Post

                              Sorry to hear that. Heal up strong! Do you compete?
                              Thank you!

                              I havent competed for years, but the aim was to do so this year - then hurt the achilles - so pushed back to next year, and now this hamstring tear!

                              Just masters events, of course. Mid life crisis type aim.

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                              • #45
                                I had a great day on my local grass track today running at 4min 16 seconds pace for a mile.

                                A pity I only made to the 100m mark
                                Last edited by Tuariki; 10-21-2021, 07:02 AM.

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