Micthell PED Report Leak

[jazzcyclist]

It's amazing that Mitchell was able to implicate so many people without subpoena power or the right to grant immunity, the tools that Barry Bonds' prosecutor has. Without those tools, he was only able to scratch the tip of the iceberg, otherwise the majority of MLB players would have been implicated.

[bijanc]

PED's

Too bad PED's didn't appreciably lengthen the careers of or lessen the injuries suffered by Bagwell, McGwire, Brady Anderson, John Rocker, Kevin Brown, Mo Vaughn, Juan Gonzalez, Darryl Kile, Andy Pettitte, Denny Neagle, Todd Hundley, Matt Williams, and the not-so-old when his stats dropped Sosa.

Knoblauch and Ankiel experienced so much difficulty throwing accurately in the late 1990's that they were released. Very different than losing velocity.

BCB

[26mi235]

Re: PED's

Too bad PED's didn't appreciably lengthen the careers of or lessen the injuries suffered by Bagwell, McGwire, Brady Anderson, John Rocker, Kevin Brown, Mo Vaughn, Juan Gonzalez, Darryl Kile, Andy Pettitte, Denny Neagle, Todd Hundley, Matt Williams, and the not-so-old when his stats dropped Sosa.

Knoblauch and Ankiel experienced so much difficulty throwing accurately in the late 1990's that they were released. Very different than losing velocity.

BCB

Oh, to have had Sandy Koufax at the top of his game for another five years....

[jazzcyclist]

If MLB was serious, they would tell the MLBPA that they must agree to the type of testing that the IAAF and UCI has. And if they refused, they should tell them that until they agree to this type of testing program, they will be locked out.

[26mi235]

If MLB was serious, they would tell the MLBPA that they must agree to the type of testing that the IAAF and UCI has. And if they refused, they should tell them that until they agree to this type of testing program, they will be locked out.

There is always the 'nuclear' option -- the exemption that baseball has received from Congress. If Fehr et al do not testify under oath to Congress then they can go back to square one. Losing that advantage would be quite costly to the teams and to the players. Teams that had the sense to put clauses into contracts might be able/willing to abrogate them, which is one of the fears of the Players Union.

Do you think MLB and the NFL are as clean as cycling (and T&F)?

[jazzcyclist]

Do you think MLB and the NFL are as clean as cycling (and T&F)?

Considering the facts that the 2007 Tour de France was the slowest in 13 years and the 2007 IAAF women's 100 final was the slowest in history, No.

[26mi235]

Do you think MLB and the NFL are as clean as cycling (and T&F)?

Considering the facts that the 2007 Tour de France was the slowest in 13 years and the 2007 IAAF women's 100 final was the slowest in history, No.

The Tour speed is interesting but a little 'thin' on its own. I am not denying your comment but saying it is not clear without looking carefully.

First, a number of top riders and one of the ProTour teams were not in it. Second, there were more headwinds and fewer tailwinds, which can lead to a couple of modest pace hours in which there is little benefit of pushing at the front, and escapes usually involve the secondary guys and they are limited in speed. Missing was the very fast Team Time Trial and the ITTs were not on fast courses. There were no dominant teams so that things play out slower etc. Then the leader was removed (although that was only a few minutes).

I would of jazzcyclist could add his two cents in.

[EPelle]

Congratulate the game for instituting a more stringent testing policy than any other major professional sport, but condemn it for first allowing the muscleheads to trash the record books while looking the other way. This morning's box score: Players connected to steroids or HGH in the Mitchell Report combined for 113 All-Star appearances, 13 Most Valuable Player awards, eight Cy Young awards and four Rookie of the Year awards.

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10528476

[Daisy]

Congratulate the game for instituting a more stringent testing policy than any other major professional sport, but condemn it for first allowing the muscleheads to trash the record books while looking the other way. This morning's box score: Players connected to steroids or HGH in the Mitchell Report combined for 113 All-Star appearances, 13 Most Valuable Player awards, eight Cy Young awards and four Rookie of the Year awards.

http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10528476

"more stringent testing policy than any other major professional sport" Huh?

[EPelle]

MLB irritates madly with its self-bias.

[EPelle]

• Victor Conte, founder and president of BALCO: "I am very disappointed with the findings and recommendations contained in the Mitchell Report. This was certainly the wrong message to send to kids. There needs to be some type of appropriate consequences as a result of the wrongdoing that was found. It seems that this report is an attempt to sweep a massive problem that has existed for decades under the rug with a single sweep of the broom. ... In short, the report favors those who control the money in baseball."

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti ... /312140028

“The president said he thought long and hard about it. He just does not recall hearing or seeing it. And I don’t think it’s time for regret. I think it’s time to do what the president has done, which has been to take time in his State of the Union to shine a light on the issue. Now we have the result of a report that is getting a lot of attention, and deservedly so.” Perino, when asked whether President Bush regrets not knowing about steroid use when he was co-owner of the Texas Rangers.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti ... /312140008

[bambam]

Do you think MLB and the NFL are as clean as cycling (and T&F)?

I'd be willing to bet that if the NFL (National Felons League) had the same stringent testing policies as the IOC and IAAF require, close to 100% of down linemen and those in strength positions (basically everybody but kickers, receivers, QBs, and defensive backs) would test positive at some time in their career.

[tafnut]

100% of down linemen . . . would test positive at some time in their career.

As I've said before, Mama Nature don't make many 300-pounders with 8% body fat, unless you're at least 6'8!

[EPelle]

Carl:s Junior, BK and Micky D:s makes all those who mother nature skipped past.

[jazzcyclist]

Do you think MLB and the NFL are as clean as cycling (and T&F)?

Considering the facts that the 2007 Tour de France was the slowest in 13 years and the 2007 IAAF women's 100 final was the slowest in history, No.

The Tour speed is interesting but a little 'thin' on its own. I am not denying your comment but saying it is not clear without looking carefully.

First, a number of top riders and one of the ProTour teams were not in it. Second, there were more headwinds and fewer tailwinds, which can lead to a couple of modest pace hours in which there is little benefit of pushing at the front, and escapes usually involve the secondary guys and they are limited in speed. Missing was the very fast Team Time Trial and the ITTs were not on fast courses. There were no dominant teams so that things play out slower etc. Then the leader was removed (although that was only a few minutes).

I would of jazzcyclist could add his two cents in.

1) Where did you get your information about the winds being more unfavorable than in previous years?
2) You're right about there not being a team time trial, but there was no TTT in 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999 or 2006 either. As for the individual time trials, let's not forget that the 2001 and 2004 Tours featured mountain ITT's (>8% grade) which were a lot slower than the 2007 ITT's.