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  • #46
    Originally posted by Vince
    Just a little while back Spector was saying he was staying a Republican. It's Senators like him that bring the trustworthy ratings of Congress down lower than G.W. Bush.

    Spector was the @&*!* that helped get Ira Einhorn out on bail , so he could run off and hide in Europe before standing trial for killing his girlfriend and stuffing her in a box in his closet until the smell got so bad it was noticed by other people.

    He's a good fit for the Democrats. We might be surprised at the next Senate races.
    Its true he did say that.

    Of note I suppose, is that he was still a republican when he did. :lol:
    The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

    Comment


    • #47
      I think this says more about the current status of the GOP than about Arlen Specter.
      Not easy being a moderate in that party at this time.
      Specter was a democrat in his youth. I'm not a great fan of Specter. Can't forget the way he went after Anita Hill during the Clarence Thomas hearings.

      Comment


      • #48
        Hopefully, Olympia Snowe and Susan Collins will be next.
        They say no. The difference is the GOP won't be able to find candidates to label them as "rinos" which would have happened years ago anywhere else. It would be laughed at in Maine.
        Maybe if things got really bad (like being asked to wear a Scarlet letter instead of a flag pin), they might go the Indy route.

        Comment


        • #49
          There was a great op-ed in the New York Times by Olympia Snowea couple of days ago.
          It is true that being a Republican moderate sometimes feels like being a cast member of “Survivor” — you are presented with multiple challenges, and you often get the distinct feeling that you’re no longer welcome in the tribe. But it is truly a dangerous signal that a Republican senator of nearly three decades no longer felt able to remain in the party. . . . .

          There is no plausible scenario under which Republicans can grow into a majority while shrinking our ideological confines and continuing to retract into a regional party. Ideological purity is not the ticket back to the promised land of governing majorities — indeed, it was when we began to emphasize social issues to the detriment of some of our basic tenets as a party that we encountered an electoral backlash.

          It is for this reason that we should heed the words of President Ronald Reagan, who urged, “We should emphasize the things that unite us and make these the only ‘litmus test’ of what constitutes a Republican: our belief in restraining government spending, pro-growth policies, tax reduction, sound national defense, and maximum individual liberty.” He continued, “As to the other issues that draw on the deep springs of morality and emotion, let us decide that we can disagree among ourselves as Republicans and tolerate the disagreement.”
          Bill Clinton was one of the leading voices that convinced Democrats to remove gun control as one of the central tenets of the Democratic platform or risk being a permanent minority party. As a result, Obama would not have gotten the push back from Democrats if he had chosen the pro-gun Jim Webb as his running mate that McCain got for considering the pro-choice Kay Bailey-Hutchinson and Tom Ridge as his. Will Snowe be the one to convince Republicans to remove social issues as central tenets of the Republican platform?

          Comment


          • #50
            If you feel like you have become "disconnected" from your party, wouldn't it seem logical to become an Independent? Just curious what everyone thinks.

            Comment


            • #51
              But in many (most?) places, doesn't being independent disenfranchise you from a lot of the decision-making process that leads to elections?

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by gh
                But in many (most?) places, doesn't being independent disenfranchise you from a lot of the decision-making process that leads to elections?
                And party funding . . .

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                  Originally posted by Vince
                  Just a little while back Spector was saying he was staying a Republican. It's Senators like him that bring the trustworthy ratings of Congress down lower than G.W. Bush.

                  Spector was the @&*!* that helped get Ira Einhorn out on bail , so he could run off and hide in Europe before standing trial for killing his girlfriend and stuffing her in a box in his closet until the smell got so bad it was noticed by other people.

                  He's a good fit for the Democrats. We might be surprised at the next Senate races.
                  Its true he did say that.

                  Of note I suppose, is that he was still a republican when he did. :lol:
                  He was indeed, but many knew(Biden) he was a Manchurian Democrat.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by deca-pat
                    If you feel like you have become "disconnected" from your party, wouldn't it seem logical to become an Independent? Just curious what everyone thinks.
                    Yes, but essentially thats isolation... devoid of authority -perceived or real.

                    Realistically (that is for all practical and literal purposes)... we're a two party system.

                    That said, one's conscience should indicate the proper course and not a desire to collaborate just for the sake of it.

                    IMO
                    The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by jazzcyclist
                      There was a great op-ed in the New York Times by Olympia Snowea couple of days ago.
                      It is true that being a Republican moderate sometimes feels like being a cast member of “Survivor” — you are presented with multiple challenges, and you often get the distinct feeling that you’re no longer welcome in the tribe. But it is truly a dangerous signal that a Republican senator of nearly three decades no longer felt able to remain in the party. . . . .

                      There is no plausible scenario under which Republicans can grow into a majority while shrinking our ideological confines and continuing to retract into a regional party. Ideological purity is not the ticket back to the promised land of governing majorities — indeed, it was when we began to emphasize social issues to the detriment of some of our basic tenets as a party that we encountered an electoral backlash.

                      It is for this reason that we should heed the words of President Ronald Reagan, who urged, “We should emphasize the things that unite us and make these the only ‘litmus test’ of what constitutes a Republican: our belief in restraining government spending, pro-growth policies, tax reduction, sound national defense, and maximum individual liberty.” He continued, “As to the other issues that draw on the deep springs of morality and emotion, let us decide that we can disagree among ourselves as Republicans and tolerate the disagreement.”
                      Bill Clinton was one of the leading voices that convinced Democrats to remove gun control as one of the central tenets of the Democratic platform or risk being a permanent minority party. As a result, Obama would not have gotten the push back from Democrats if he had chosen the pro-gun Jim Webb as his running mate that McCain got for considering the pro-choice Kay Bailey-Hutchinson and Tom Ridge as his. Will Snowe be the one to convince Republicans to remove social issues as central tenets of the Republican platform?
                      She makes some excellent observations/recommendations.

                      I dont remember Reagan saying that but I'm impressed that he did.

                      And these opinions come from a guy who never votes straight ticket.
                      The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by bad hammy
                        Originally posted by gh
                        But in many (most?) places, doesn't being independent disenfranchise you from a lot of the decision-making process that leads to elections?
                        And party funding . . .
                        Unless you have a few billion dollars at your disposal like Ross Perot.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          I think the safest label to give Specter is Pragmatist. He's been disenfranchised from both parties.

                          Specter was a D back when he became an asst. DA in Philadelphia in 1959. In 1965, he wasn't seen as being enough of a D to get the Ds nomination for Philly DA. The Rs offered to let him run on their ticket, and Specter won, despite still being a registered D. He became a registered R in, I think, '66, and then ran for mayor as an R in '67.

                          As for Pennsylvania politics, the state has generally been governed by centrist Rs. But the last six years or so have seriously damaged that base, with more than 200,000 defections to the Ds over the last year-and-a-half.

                          Specter stood virtually no chance of winning the R nomination this time around, particularly with the out-of-state money that was going to pour in to defeat him.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by dj
                            Specter stood virtually no chance of winning the R nomination this time around.
                            So now they'll get their candidate of choice. Will be interesting to see how well their preferred one does. No doubt they'll win in Dover.

                            [edit]
                            Re: Dover, actually, I take that back.
                            http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/10/natio ... .html?_r=1

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by jazzcyclist
                              Originally posted by gm
                              Goldwater did not support the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and he lost the presidential election by one of the largest landslides in history. Hardly someone whose legacy I would want to hang my hat on, and a man I have nothing but distaste for.
                              My mentioning of Goldwater had nothing to do with my opinion of him. I only mentioned him because I feel that, like Specter, he would also be ostracized from the Republican Party if he were around today, and he was the de facto leader of the Republican Party when LBJ signed the Civil Rights Bill.
                              you might be confusing Barry Goldwater with someone else. I dont think Barry signed the "Civil Rights Bill". He was the far right wing of the GOP. You might be thinking of Everett Dirksen, another honorable gentlemen.
                              ... nothing really ever changes my friend, new lines for old, new lines for old.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by paulthefan
                                Originally posted by jazzcyclist
                                Originally posted by gm
                                Goldwater did not support the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and he lost the presidential election by one of the largest landslides in history. Hardly someone whose legacy I would want to hang my hat on, and a man I have nothing but distaste for.
                                My mentioning of Goldwater had nothing to do with my opinion of him. I only mentioned him because I feel that, like Specter, he would also be ostracized from the Republican Party if he were around today, and he was the de facto leader of the Republican Party when LBJ signed the Civil Rights Bill.
                                you might be confusing Barry Goldwater with someone else. I dont think Barry signed the "Civil Rights Bill". He was the far right wing of the GOP.
                                :? Huh :?:
                                LBJ = Lyndon Baines Johnson

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