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  • #16
    Originally posted by Daisy
    Originally posted by Marlow
    Originally posted by Daisy
    is not comparable to breeding and killing an animal.
    Um . . . we do that all the time.
    Yep, I'm not sure I'm that comfortable with factory farming either. And to bad hammy, I'm no boxing fan either.

    Whether the punishment fits the crime, I do not know, but to breed dogs to fight is definitely on one end of the spectrum. To exploit human fighters is there too. To kill wild animals is not at that end of the spectrum when done correctly. (disclaimer; I'm not a hunter and do not condone hunting, actually I can't believe I'm even defending them, but Michael Vick, most are not)
    So you're suggesting that in some way he's worse?

    How?

    Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
    The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

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    • #17
      Originally posted by TrackDaddy
      Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
      Not much worse, but i don't see a prolonged cruelty element in hunting.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by TrackDaddy

        So you're suggesting that in some way he's worse?

        How?

        Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
        Yes what he did is worse. Much worse. I'm not a proponent of hunting, in fact I deplore it, especially trophy hunting. But I do understand the arguments of those who hunt and then eat their kill.

        After watching an HBO piece on Vick and dog fighting a year or so ago, it's hard to have any sympathy for him whatsoever. It was barbarically cruel, and has no place in our society.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Daisy
          Originally posted by TrackDaddy
          Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
          Not much worse, but i don't see a prolonged cruelty element in hunting.
          Killing for sport (pleasure . . . fun) is all the way to the end of my spectrum.

          Comment


          • #20
            I'm not a hunter, and would not enjoy it, but can think of few things more natural for humans to do. We have hunted from day one about a million years ago.

            They stab it with their steely knives but they just cant kill the beast.
            phsstt!

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by marknhj
              Originally posted by TrackDaddy

              So you're suggesting that in some way he's worse?

              How?

              Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
              Yes what he did is worse. Much worse. I'm not a proponent of hunting, in fact I deplore it, especially trophy hunting. But I do understand the arguments of those who hunt and then eat their kill.

              After watching an HBO piece on Vick and dog fighting a year or so ago, it's hard to have any sympathy for him whatsoever. It was barbarically cruel, and has no place in our society.
              You say its worse, but dont say how. :?

              Most of the people in this country who hunt and eat their kill do it for the sport. That is, they don't have to, they WANT to. They want to shoot something, watch it die and then gut it with a buck knife.

              We all know it's much cheaper to stop by Kroger and get your meal than to spend $700 hunting for wild pig. Many sporting acts involve killing animals.

              As for dog fighting, well first lets look at the pit bull and what its historically and currently bred to do. Initially bred to manage bulls in the ring, I believe and currently bred for the most part to be vicious.

              Does any dog kill more humans annually than pit bulls?

              Most people wouldn't even own a pit bull based on their reputation alone.

              IN FACT, some insurance companies won't even write you a homeowners policy if you own one! :shock:

              But when this Vick thing came up people who wouldn't even pet a pit bull, much less own one, were so hurt and disturbed. :roll:

              Puleeeeassseee.

              Another thing...dog fighting isn't new. Cockfighting isnt new. People fighting isnt new. Only PETA is new. :roll:

              Below is NOT a justification, just an observation:

              Culturally speaking (see any almanac or encyclopedia) people of different backgrounds and cultures find different things acceptable.

              I grew up in the hood. As I've said in here before, my neighborhood was so bad, the ice cream man sold dope. Seriously.

              Dogfighting was not uncommon. Personally I didnt have the stomach for it, but it wasn't unusual for boys to want to see whose dog was tougher. People would bet to see who would win. You know like hispanics are known for backroad cockfighting? It's a cultural thing that another culture may not understand or find offensive. All cultures have them. After the fight guys would nurse their dogs back to health.

              It didn't hurt that DOGS WANT TO FIGHT. In fact, we have to train them not to. Its instinctive...no?

              While Vick knew that it was illegal, its quite possible and even likely that he didnt fully understand how the dominant culture would react to his participation.

              That is, he underestimated the gravity of his acts and the potential repercussions associated with them. Especially since killing animals in this country is relatively routine, particularly by the dominant culture. He probably figured hey, "Peyton Manning hunts bears", you know?

              And he paid a huge price for what he did. Far beyond what his actions warranted. The video you saw was the type of thing used to fuel the anti Vick sentiment and to completely destroy this young man taking him from being an NFL QB adored by youth and a QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLAR income and sending where many other young black males go...

              To prison in shackles.

              What he did was worse to you than what people who hunt do.

              But not to me. I find it patently hypocritical to hunt for sport and condemn other cultures for their vicious animal sports as though yours is more civilized.
              The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                You know like hispanics are known for backroad cockfighting? It's a cultural thing that another culture may not understand or find offensive. All cultures have them. After the fight guys would nurse their dogs back to health.
                Born and spent most of childhood in south Florida (Lauderdale)...I saw dog & cockfights pretty often. Not excusing Vick, but VERY suprised by the hoopla and over-reaction.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Daisy
                  Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                  What he did was worse to you than what people who hunt do.

                  But not to me. I find it patently hypocritical to hunt for sport and condemn other cultures for their vicious animal sports as though yours is more civilized.
                  You're putting words into other peoples mouths here.
                  Really, Daisy?

                  Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                  Is what he did worse than killing an animal to make a wall trophy or a throw rug?
                  Originally posted by marknjh
                  Yes what he did is worse. Much worse.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                    The video you saw was the type of thing used to fuel the anti Vick sentiment and to completely destroy this young man taking him from being an NFL QB adored by youth and a QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLAR income and sending where many other young black males go...
                    Ah, I see where you're coming from. I'm curious, did you see the HBO program I referred to? A simple yes or no will suffice.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by TrakFan
                      Originally posted by Daisy
                      Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                      What he did was worse to you than what people who hunt do.
                      But not to me. I find it patently hypocritical to hunt for sport and condemn other cultures for their vicious animal sports as though yours is more civilized.
                      You're putting words into other peoples mouths here.
                      Really, Daisy?
                      Yes, really. See bolded text.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by marknhj
                        Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                        The video you saw was the type of thing used to fuel the anti Vick sentiment and to completely destroy this young man taking him from being an NFL QB adored by youth and a QUARTER OF A BILLION DOLLAR income and sending where many other young black males go...
                        Ah, I see where you're coming from. I'm curious, did you see the HBO program I referred to? A simple yes or no will suffice.
                        Uh...no it woudn't.

                        No, I didnt see it, but I've seen a number of dogfighting documentary/exposes shown because of the Vick controversy.
                        The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Daisy
                          Originally posted by TrakFan
                          Originally posted by Daisy
                          Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                          What he did was worse to you than what people who hunt do.
                          But not to me. I find it patently hypocritical to hunt for sport and condemn other cultures for their vicious animal sports as though yours is more civilized.
                          You're putting words into other peoples mouths here.
                          Really, Daisy?
                          Yes, really. See bolded text.
                          Actually TrakFan is right.

                          I didn't put words into anyone's mouth.

                          When I say 'yours' it's a general statement intended to be understood where aplicable.

                          Not necessarily mark or anyone here at all.

                          In fact, Mark said he didnt support hunting of any kind...no?
                          The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by TrakFan
                            Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                            You know like hispanics are known for backroad cockfighting? It's a cultural thing that another culture may not understand or find offensive. All cultures have them. After the fight guys would nurse their dogs back to health.
                            Born and spent most of childhood in south Florida (Lauderdale)...I saw dog & cockfights pretty often. Not excusing Vick, but VERY suprised by the hoopla and over-reaction.
                            Let me ask you about cockfighting TrakFan...

                            What is the big deal in your mind?

                            I ask because I've never quite gotten it.

                            I mean we eat chickens anyway...no?

                            What kind of future doea a chicken have anyway....a slaughterhouse? We cut their heads off and fry them. We put them in salads and on sandwhiches.

                            But you get arrested if you let them fight? :roll:

                            Maybe gambling is the issue because giving a chicken rights at this point is silly.

                            A chicken who's successful in life may end up working for the Colonel.

                            And we know how that would end. :lol:
                            The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                              Originally posted by TrakFan
                              Originally posted by TrackDaddy
                              You know like hispanics are known for backroad cockfighting? It's a cultural thing that another culture may not understand or find offensive. All cultures have them. After the fight guys would nurse their dogs back to health.
                              Born and spent most of childhood in south Florida (Lauderdale)...I saw dog & cockfights pretty often. Not excusing Vick, but VERY suprised by the hoopla and over-reaction.
                              Let me ask you about cockfighting TrakFan...

                              What is the big deal in your mind?

                              I ask because I've never quite gotten it.

                              I mean we eat chickens anyway...no?

                              What kind of future doea a chicken have anyway....a slaughterhouse? We cut their heads off and fry them. We put them in salads and on sandwhiches.

                              But you get arrested if you let them fight? :roll:

                              Maybe gambling is the issue because giving a chicken rights at this point is silly.

                              A chicken who's successful in life may end up working for the Colonel.

                              And we know how that would end
                              . :lol:
                              Especially in light of the recently sponsored Oprah chicken promo.... :lol: :wink:

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Hahahaha! :lol:
                                The fool has said...there is no God. Psa 14

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