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  • rasb
    replied
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    Originally posted by dakota
    There's absolutely no excuse for putting mayonnaise on anything. What a reprehensibly wicked thing to inflict on people. They must be stopped.
    If you're interested, I have a plan.

    At least on the music front, try this.....Every 4th song has to be a slow-dance, and you can't dance with someone of the same "shade"as you....I think people will work it out from there....

    Leave a comment:


  • TrackDaddy
    replied
    Originally posted by dakota
    There's absolutely no excuse for putting mayonnaise on anything. What a reprehensibly wicked thing to inflict on people. They must be stopped.
    If you're interested, I have a plan.

    Leave a comment:


  • KevinM
    replied
    Good lord. Really? Prom is being taken this seriously?

    The point of a prom is to celebrate the end of your high school years (or the school year, in the event of underclassmen), not to have a cultural expo.

    How hard is this to do? 1) Have a prom committee. 2) Have the committee come up with an eclectic menu (if food is involved) and playlist. 3) Done. If you don't like hip hop, don't dance when those songs come on (though in most places, white teens dance to hip hop as much as any other music). If you don't like country, don't dance when it comes up.

    On the flip side, aren't references to Jim Crow out of whack if the all-white prom is put on by parents (and not with school money), as seems to be the case here? Doesn't make it any more respectable, but I think it's better to be accurate here.

    Leave a comment:


  • Pego
    replied
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    Originally posted by Pego
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    But do you believe the prom issue to be based in perceived preference or in Jim Crow-ish type bigotry?
    I don't know about jazzcyclist (actually, I do), but my answer is an unqualified "Yes".
    Which one?

    People being a given a preference to attend a prom more "conformant" to their likes, or Jim Crow era type bigotry?
    The latter.

    Leave a comment:


  • dakota
    replied
    There's absolutely no excuse for putting mayonnaise on anything. What a reprehensibly wicked thing to inflict on people. They must be stopped.

    Leave a comment:


  • TrackDaddy
    replied
    Originally posted by dakota
    On the question of whether this is bigotry or cultural preference, I think the various articles make clear this is something which is being dictated by the parents, which seems dubious to me, because when did the youth generation ever willingly accept their social cues from old fogies. And it's also pretty clear that what the parents are doing is racist, and it's sad that the kids have to put up with such bullshit, and you just hope these bigoted attitudes don't get perpetuated for another generation in some families and peer groups because of it, or that it causes any lasting psychological suspicions to colour the views of how society is for those on the receiving end of it, because if this is what the prom is like, you can bet a lot else is rotten in that town too. There probably is a widespread local assumption in some quarters that there's nothing wrong with it, but that doesn't make it so. Maybe in some kind of post racial society this would be less of an issue, but I get the feeling some parts of twenty first century Georgia aren't there yet. I don't think it would even occur to people who weren't racist to bring race into this, you'd just throw a "fried chicken party", or whatever, and invite anybody to come who wants to because they like the sound of that as much as TrackDaddy does. Whereas I think the parents who are the bouncers for the "white" prom are definitely enforcing the BNP dress code. Hopefully they have men and women in the community who see things the way Jazzcyclist's dad and the mayor did in his story.
    Mandating that someone doesnt have the option of attending either function is clearly questionable.

    However providing options for personal choice or preferred assembly...isnt.

    Because I'm a minority...I've been to many sanctioned events where the music was country, the food was full of mayonnaise :lol: , and conversation didnt completely interest me...with no other option.

    Majority rules and thats fine.

    But from time to time...I'd like other options.

    Flip the script and see how you'd feel.

    Leave a comment:


  • TrackDaddy
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzcyclist
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    Originally posted by jazzcyclist
    Amen! The thing is that separate was never meant to be equal, at least not in the U.S. For example, when my father graduated from high school in 1959, the state of Louisiana paid $56 per pupil to Black schools and $125 per pupil to White schools, and they called that equal. :evil: The books that Black schools got were always hand-me-downs from White schools, which means that White students were the only ones who ever saw new books. Furthermore, since White students knew their books would end up in Black schools they made a point to write all kinds or racist and demeaning things in the books.
    jc

    Being born during the civil rights movement and being from Texas I actually lived this as a student in the 1960s and 70s.
    I think you're about the same age as me, give or take a year, and I think you'll agree with me that we never experienced Jim Crow in any significant way. You may have experienced racism, but not the state-sanctioned racial discrimantion that our parents experienced.
    I was referring to the hand me down school books you mentioned and segregated classrooms.

    Leave a comment:


  • TrackDaddy
    replied
    Originally posted by Pego
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    But do you believe the prom issue to be based in perceived preference or in Jim Crow-ish type bigotry?
    I don't know about jazzcyclist (actually, I do), but my answer is an unqualified "Yes".
    Which one?

    People being a given a preference to attend a prom more "conformant" to their likes, or Jim Crow era type bigotry?

    Leave a comment:


  • SQUACKEE
    replied
    Originally posted by dakota
    Paragraph fascist!
    Sorry, i think your post was great and was trying to help. It's hard for me not to interfear because im so good at grammar and spealing and what not. :P

    Leave a comment:


  • dakota
    replied
    Paragraph fascist!

    Leave a comment:


  • SQUACKEE
    replied
    Originally posted by dakota
    On the question of whether this is bigotry or cultural preference, I think the various articles make clear this is something which is being dictated by the parents, which seems dubious to me, because when did the youth generation ever willingly accept their social cues from old fogies.

    And it's also pretty clear that what the parents are doing is racist, and it's sad that the kids have to put up with such bullshit, and you just hope these bigoted attitudes don't get perpetuated for another generation in some families and peer groups because of it, or that it causes any lasting psychological suspicions to colour the views of how society is for those on the receiving end of it, because if this is what the prom is like, you can bet a lot else is rotten in that town too.

    There probably is a widespread local assumption in some quarters that there's nothing wrong with it, but that doesn't make it so. Maybe in some kind of post racial society this would be less of an issue, but I get the feeling some parts of twenty first century Georgia aren't there yet. I don't think it would even occur to people who weren't racist to bring race into this, you'd just throw a "fried chicken party", or whatever, and invite anybody to come who wants to because they like the sound of that as much as TrackDaddy does

    Whereas I think the parents who are the bouncers for the "white" prom are definitely enforcing the BNP dress code. Hopefully they have men and women in the community who see things the way Jazzcyclist's dad and the mayor did in his story.
    :wink:

    Leave a comment:


  • dakota
    replied
    On the question of whether this is bigotry or cultural preference, I think the various articles make clear this is something which is being dictated by the parents, which seems dubious to me, because when did the youth generation ever willingly accept their social cues from old fogies. And it's also pretty clear that what the parents are doing is racist, and it's sad that the kids have to put up with such bullshit, and you just hope these bigoted attitudes don't get perpetuated for another generation in some families and peer groups because of it, or that it causes any lasting psychological suspicions to colour the views of how society is for those on the receiving end of it, because if this is what the prom is like, you can bet a lot else is rotten in that town too. There probably is a widespread local assumption in some quarters that there's nothing wrong with it, but that doesn't make it so. Maybe in some kind of post racial society this would be less of an issue, but I get the feeling some parts of twenty first century Georgia aren't there yet. I don't think it would even occur to people who weren't racist to bring race into this, you'd just throw a "fried chicken party", or whatever, and invite anybody to come who wants to because they like the sound of that as much as TrackDaddy does. Whereas I think the parents who are the bouncers for the "white" prom are definitely enforcing the BNP dress code. Hopefully they have men and women in the community who see things the way Jazzcyclist's dad and the mayor did in his story.

    Leave a comment:


  • SQUACKEE
    replied
    Wow, Jazz- mesmerizing. My deepest respect for your father's service and my deepest sympathy for what he came home to.

    Leave a comment:


  • kuha
    replied
    Jazz: Powerful story; thank you.

    Leave a comment:


  • jazzcyclist
    replied
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    Originally posted by jazzcyclist
    Amen! The thing is that separate was never meant to be equal, at least not in the U.S. For example, when my father graduated from high school in 1959, the state of Louisiana paid $56 per pupil to Black schools and $125 per pupil to White schools, and they called that equal. :evil: The books that Black schools got were always hand-me-downs from White schools, which means that White students were the only ones who ever saw new books. Furthermore, since White students knew their books would end up in Black schools they made a point to write all kinds or racist and demeaning things in the books.
    jc

    Being born during the civil rights movement and being from Texas I actually lived this as a student in the 1960s and 70s.
    I think you're about the same age as me, give or take a year, and I think you'll agree with me that we never experienced Jim Crow in any significant way. You may have experienced racism, but not the state-sanctioned racial discrimantion that our parents experienced. The only thing I can remember is sitting in a segregated waiting room at the doctor's office as a small child, but at that point I wasn't yet old enough to realize that I was experiencing Jim Crow. Also, initially Blacks were banned from little league baseball in my town, but I didn't know this until years later. The story goes like this:

    When I got old enough to play, my Dad who had just returned from Vietnam, found out that Blacks were banned. So he went down to the mayor's house that night and assured him that either I would be on one of the teams by opening day or he would get his rifle and go to the ballpark and insure that our town would be the lead story of the national news the next day. What happened is that the mayor called an emergency meeting with the city council that night and they decided to form two new teams to accomodate the Black kids and we would be allowed to play in the city league with everyone else. That first year there were two all-Black teams and six all-White teams in the league, since the White teams had already been picked and been given uniforms, but next year and from then on, the teams were integrated. Looking back, it all makes sense, like why we didn't get our uniforms until a couple of games after opening day and why our uniforms were new and the White kids had used uniforms.

    My Dad also integrated the local bowling alley in a similar fashion. On many occasions, I've heard his sisters talk about what a different person he was when he returned from Vietnam and one them even blames Vietnam for my parents' divorce. Today he talks about how dangerous he was back then and how he's grateful he is that God watched over him and stopped him from ever doing anything foolish, but considering that he went through both Tet Offensives and returned home from the Mekong Delta just a few days after MLK was assassinated, I can understand.

    I believe there were probably other instances like this when I was a toddler and my parents were taking me places, but I was too young to remember.
    Originally posted by TrackDaddy
    But do you believe the prom issue to be based in perceived preference or in Jim Crow-ish type bigotry?
    I'll go with the latter.

    Leave a comment:

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